It’s surprising how many people here didn’t seem to notice that this thread is just riffing off of one with the exact same title, only replacing ‘M+’ with ‘raiding’.
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Steam forums allows you to do that. Blizzard needs to step it up. 
Only a matter of time before one with Delves get caught in the crossfire. 
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I feel like there’s certainly been a shift among the general playerbase, and raiding isn’t seen as the holy endgame grail it once was.
We simply have a lot more options for endgame now.
Even PvPers ‘had to raid’ back in the day, for the best stuff.
Like in Wrath, Shadowmourne was just scary to see in any PvP.
Armor Penetration was a stat back then too, and all the best ArPen stuff was on PvE gear, especially trinkets.
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Exactly. I love raiding partly for the raids themselves, but also just because I like hanging out with my friends. It’s a few hours a week we can kill bosses together and just joke around and have fun. 
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Do ya’ll think people realize just how dumb they make themselves sound, whether trolling or not?
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Agreed, delete raids.
Wow gets better with a casual approach. I quit the treadmills and just play when I want for how long I want and honestly I haven’t enjoyed the game this much in years.
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Lol @ OP getting flagged.
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Hard disagree. 40M Naxx, Molten Core, Black Temple, and ICC made this game what it is, and Heroic raiding enouraged Heroic dungeons which inspired Mythic Plus.
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gr8 b8 m8 i rate 8/8
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Wait until you realize raiding was the core part of wow until m+ came to be.
They were second to none when they are current. That’s for sure. Like icc prog way back when. Like holy heck. But then again, we also had the story as a strong driving factor too.
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Sounds like a minimal effort Andy.
Classic is bad and for those who can’t play retail.
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“Anti WoW” - coming from a Dracthyr
“when it was 40 man” - dude‘s been playing for four years. Think he knows something about the game.
Go away and learn how to play
Anyone wanna tell this guy that raiding has been an endgame pillar since vanilla and that it was the only endgame pillar until M+ was released?
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I think What this guy is trying to say is that finding groups for raids is bad. Which I actually agree with. If you have a guild most of this is moot but for pugs… Between long waits to fill, tons of trash to kill, people who quit and need to be replaced, waiting for stragglers or backfills when you have no warlock… The raid can easily turn into sitting around for 75% of the experience. Ffxiv let’s you just queue, don’t get why LFR and that concept hasn’t evolved since it’s conception in wow.
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You could have just said you don’t have any friends to play with and that you’re too lazy to get to know people in a guild.
People who only pug deserve what they get. Complaining about community and then refusing guilds lol.
Begone troll.
It’s a bit ironic, because instanced content is indeed not part of the open world, and is therefore not as massive.
Also, the game tends to freeze up when multiple raids of people are in one singular area, threatening to down the whole server lol.
It’s an MMO, yeah, but there’s limits on just how ‘massive’ it can be.
Seems like 20-25 is the upper limit now, for smoothness most likely.
Epic BGs still have 40 people, but you’re likely still gonna get frame issues during the clashes lol.
Its not sunday.
Well no. Retail raid is pointless but vanilla and up to shadowlands raiding was worth it
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