Maybe on Alliance, but on Horde the Hunters are usually their own group because windfury > TSA.
TSA is pointless for horde hunters as soon as it can be replaced.
Its more WAY more DPS once you reach enough bonus agility to = 100 AP.
Throw shadow priests on this list for shiggles
Alliance Hunters also have Kings though, which is more beneficial. You have a good point about that though once the bonus damage is also not worth it from MM talents.
Hunters are trash in PvP, all a rogue needs to beat you is to have sprint up.
Hunters only lose to rogues when they have an opener on you especially right now with low gear levels and we don’t have a PvP trinket
Once we have both of those it’s much more reliable for hunters to beat rogues
and if they don’t get an opener on you you’re absolutely safe too and they’ll die very easily to you
Like if you’re dueling right now, if they get an opener they win and if they don’t they lose
But in wpvp you have much more leeway to find them especially with stuff like track hidden/flares etc. and in a bg you can just hunt rogues down for a very long time
In BGs/WPvP hunters will be fine, they can still do well now in duels with good gear (I recommend watching Bean, he’s done really well with duel tourney rules and that’s with so many disadvantages against hunters with ruling too).
Hunters are good, they just have a very high skill cap but they’re still a great class imo.
Hunters are a pure DPS class. DPS is literally the only thing the class can do.
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Oh, but they’re Shadow, so they’re a DPS and not a healer nor a support.
/s
Except rogues always get the opener because using track hidden and flares when you’re trying to herb is not gonna happen, so all they need is sprint and they auto-win every fight.
Just ganked again tonight by some pathetic rogue while I was trying to pick an herb. Guess I’ll go kill level 30s for a few hours, since its the only thing Hunters can actually do.
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Can just sit on a trap then when you want to herb lol
You’re just giving a super random anecdote
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except hunters bring [Trueshot Aura] to the party, is a powerful buff for Warriors and Rogues, making Hunters a great choice to place in a melee group.
Topping DPS aint everything when it comes to raiding…
you need to go survival, and get all agi buffs, with kings and the survival talents % boosts, the more agi the sets give, the more the % pay off…
It’s a very greedy playstyle, and you’ll likely still be out-DPS’d.
This reply needs a sticky on the forum by itself. Thank you for posting this.
Most people don’t enjoy being effectively worthless and bringing nothing to the raid outside of 1-2 fights, they didn’t like it back then, and they don’t like it now. All you people telling hunters durr ur dps is bad bc you make other ppl do more are effectively missing the point.
Hunters are, out of all the dps in a raid, the worst mathematically, just because your hunter is doing x or this hunter is doing y, doesn’t change the fact. It’s not that awful right now, but it’s only going to get worse with each new phase/raid tier, hunters are just a bad dps by design for a large variety of reasons, and fixing even a few of them would be all it takes to make them competitive.
Logic being you do 500 dps but other people do 1200 is fine bc you can already clear the raid well… yes you can clear the raid, as the team cheerleader/token hunter who’s there to use tranq shot on 1 or 2 fights in the raid and otherwise just be a TSA bot for the melee who are doing nearly double (or more) your dps, most of which, I might add, is pure white damage.
Yes you can still clear the raid, pretending thats the problem is asinine. The issue is, hunters are subpar as a design, they have their niche uses but that’s it really.
Not all inclusive by any means, but a list of the issues keeping hunters from being remotely relevant
*Most buffs that increase AP/DMG don’t apply to ranged attack power, things like DM Tribute buffs, Ony Head, Battle Shout
*Competing with real dps for other sources of damage (eg, grace of air vs windfury)
*Alot of static numbers, Aspect of Hawk, Hunters Mark, Trueshot Aura, give flat AP that does not improve with gear
*Almost none of your abilities ACTUALLY scale, Arcane Shot, Serpent Sting, Volley, Traps, serpent sting does irrelevant damage, and even if it did reasonable damage, you’d have to compete for a debuff slot on the bosses that aren’t immune
*Can’t use traps in combat
*FD is bugged and doesn’t work half the time (not including resists) which is mostly a result of this unfathomably idiotic spell batching
*SPELL BATCHING the wonderful art of being hit during feign death, by a sheep, and getting stuck in combat.
*Melee leeway - aka the melee range literally longer than a hunters deadzone
*In addition to hunter pets not scaling (again, static) they die on damn near every boss or trash pull in every raid
Hunters basically just don’t scale with gear outside of auto shot, aimed shot, and multishot, which scale very poorly due to most of their damage coming from static base (eg : aimed shot is ranged damage + 600) your ranged damage scales very poorly, if it doesn’t crit it hits for nothing, and hunters literally have the worst agi to crit scaling in the game at around 54 agi or something to 1% crit, almost triple that of warriors and almost double that of rogues. Coincidentally the 2 best dps.
Also you still go oom just as fast or faster than an enhance while trying to pull off subpar deeps.
tldr hunters don’t scale with gear, most of their existence is static numbers/static damage added on to a low and poorly scaling baseline that resists most buffs, half the crit chance from agi as rogues, pets don’t scale AND die on everything, spell batching/leeway (fake lag by blizzard to emulate the days of yore, terrible system and should have never been thought of much less implemented), traps in combat not a thing, fight with much better dps over gear, also oom af if you remotely try to go ham.
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That would just cause raids to stack melee.
https ://classic.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/1000/#dataset=95&aggregate=amount
This is the 95th percentile on Warcraft Logs, which shows Hunters in 3rd place behind Rouges and Fury Warriors. Also top dps is where they got lucky with RNG and the raid did everything possible to maximize their dps. Fury Warriors can easily do insane numbers if the fight is 20 seconds long with Recklessness and Death Wish. Recklessness has a 30 minute CD and causes all hits (not blocked or glancing) to critically strike for 10 seconds. This means an ability you can very rarely use would be up for half of the fight in that parse.
But aren’t mages always saying class balance ruins the game?
hunters are amazing at farming?
wanna be rich? log ur hunter and farm elemental fires. or winterfall e’ko. or frostmaul e’ko. etc etc
best solo farmers in the game assuming its not AoE packed.
The difference in farming capabilities between a hunter, and a lock (much better in raids) is miniscule and in many cases the lock will actually perform better. Overall once you include aoe farming, mages are better at farming than hunters too.
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1 ranged dps is worth 2 meele dps at its own ranged rate, at times. that’s 1300 dps.