At what point do the lack of defensives start to become a big hassle? Primarily looking at a M+ situation.
I am debating on investing time into MM but I’m unsure what the limit is with all the damage in these dungeons.
Defensives are awful long cooldowns and if you dont have a healer that can heal more then the tank your pretty much going to die a lot lol. Until our cooldowns on defensives are reduced to a minute like many other classes are we are in bad shape once you use them up lol.
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As mentioned, our lack of defensives can be felt at any level dependent on Healer skill and/or unavoidable damage; the latter being ever more present in the latest dungeons.
That being said, our poorly optimized defensives are generally felt the most in 18+ and higher keys from what data and discussions indicate (gear, stat, and skill dependent). This is even more exacerbated during Grievous or Bursting weeks. The proclivity for groups to pull lots of trash makes the two mentioned affixes very difficult on Hunter as a class, regardless of which spec is used.
Just be ready to die very often, even if you are bottom of the Damage Taken/Healing Taken statistics. The higher the key level the more dependent we become on Versatility as a stat.
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tbh its a hassle at any level. group gets hit by unavoidable damage and everyones still at 75% hp and im below 50. lower keys you randomly die because healers arent that great at that lvl.
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The grass is already greener where you are(Warlock). I would know something about that as a 12-year Warlock main. Are you like me, who wants something a bit more challenging esoterically? I found the transition to MM from Aff/Destro well worth it.
Though I’m not sure it’s the lack of defensives as it would be the lack of OFFENSIVES for the salience of the subject matter. Just like modern armored tanks, power-to-weight ratio matters. Is Hunter worth its FREIGHT by the punch it can do? Because a Hunter that can do 10 DPS without making one stand-in-fire mistake is not really more worthwhile than a dead Hunter that then does 0 DPS.
I started noticing it pretty harshly around 17/18 but it’s noticeable pretty early in varying degrees.
I’m a Healer main, honestly I currently leave a group if I see a Hunter in higher keys, I’m talking 20+, it’s not that their dps isn’t good, but seriously there Survivability and Utility needs massive buffs.
I don’t need another player to melt as quick as me, having a Hunter in your key seriously is just added extra work for the healer, I’m my case myself, I have enough to worry about.
I’m saying this because my mate plays Hunter and when I join his keys it’s insanely more difficult then it should be, I’m seriously surprised nothing has changed for Hunters yet.
They lack utility, melee utility trumps everything a Hunter can bring, AMZ, Rallying Cry, Darkness, passive 5% physical and magic increase, Rogues can literally shut down any caster completely, these are a few examples that makes Keys infinitely easier but then compared to Range they just as bad, Arcane Intellect, Fortitude, Vampiric Embrace, Mark of the Wild are a few more examples.
What does Hunter bring?, nothing, Squishy as hell, a stun with a travel time that if thrown in a pack you pray hits the right target, binding shot that requires them to move out of it, a 20 second interrupt.
Hunters need a lot more then a buff to just Survivability, they need a reason to justify a spot in a group. Higher keys is about Dps and what they can provide to make it go as smoothly as possible.
Being a walking wet tissue paper isn’t helping, but bringing nothing else is a major design flaw, so many classes do what they do currently better.
Why not give Hunters a group/raid buff? Aspect of the Hunt, 60 minute buff that gives a 5% leech, helps with survival and gives a purpose to bring.
If 10.0.7 doesn’t change anything for Hunters I can’t see things being better for them, Blizzard has created this issue and community perception of avoiding them is warranted. I don’t blame players avoiding them to make things easier, this needs to change.
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last time that hunters had a raid buff, it was aspect of the fox and it was removed because it was too good apparently rofl
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Feel the lack of defensives a lot in high end M+ and especially pvp with melee having 10000 gap closers.
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Survivability, what’s that?
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Lowest representation in 26s and only class with zero representation in 27s. So looks like mid 20s is the soft ceiling and 26 it’s the hard cap, at least for now. I only pug and have yet to voice in keys and I’m having troubles in 22s especially if it’s tyran week. Damage is pretty great we just don’t have the buttons to survive long fights with big hits.
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Was in a group with friends doing 16+ last week. We got 2 hunters and looking at the logs the healer heal both hunters more than the tank and we die more than the rest of the group lol.
It got a point I would tell my friend don’t bother to put heal on me since I all my Def CD including hp pots is on CD and even if you pump heal on me I will still die to bursting that’s about to happen. With no Def CD and our hp top off we simply can’t survive bursting in high level. Honestly I am not sure how hunters to 20+ I am at ilvl 397 and even in a 16 I have so much issue trying to survive on bursting weeks. Compare to my other melee (heck that even includes ret pally) I survive much easier.
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There is no way this is true.
We got a BDK tank. He bascially keeps himself alive just fine. When busting hits Without turtle bascially with the other Def CD our hp will still go from 90% down to 25 to 30% so we either use a hp pot or hope the healer pick us up. Heck we even started using camouflague when we are out of combat to help regen some hp back.
Post those logs for me if you could. Also if you’re doing bursting correctly you can survive a 6 stack easily with zero healing or CDs. Outside of Turtle and pot you have Bear, Survival and Exil to deal with 7+ stack situations. Don’t get me wrong, hunter has it rough in the survivability department in high keys but saying a hunter needs more healing than a tank is ridiculous. There are plenty that of real issues to complain about.
lol ok tell them what type of heal hunter have? One lousy self heal on a long CD. If you are BM you get a bit of leech. LOL a death strike from a BDK does more healing than our self heal. How many death strike BDK use in a m+ vs how many times can a hunter use their self heal.
So you are saying a BDK can not self heal more a hunter?
It’s a question as to how the two Hunters in your group topped the list for ‘Healing Taken’ in Details, as you indicated, during last week’s Bursting affix. This would presumably indicate that either large trash pulls were being melted without the DPS managing the stacks of Bursting effectively, or that the two Hunters were standing in every ground swirl without moving.
At worst, I was in the middle for Damage Taken/Healing Taken. The majority of the time, I took the least amount of damage and healing overall yet still died to unavoidable damage due to the long CD windows with the current DR and self-healing.
When watching the party frames while unavoidable boss damage activated, the Hunter health bar was the lowest nearly every time. Occasionally a Priest or Feral Druid took similar damage.
There is a conspiracy theory that Hunters may have a hidden armor modifier that reduces the armor class causing more damage to be taken.
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This 100 %
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Fortitude of the Bear and exhilaration…I already covered this.
Nope. Never said anything close to that. Maybe try reading what I did say.
A Hunter using a defensive, which are all on insane CDs for bursting, I’d seriously quit, the issue with hunters is they using their lengthy CDs to survive mediocre damage that every other class wouldn’t need too, and then when it’s actually needed they don’t have it.
A healer shouldn’t need to baby sit a Hunter, which I find very frustrating, it’s solely the reason I refuse to bring a Hunter in higher keys.
They are difficult enough as it is, I don’t need another person to make it more difficult.
Dps means nothing when dead.
Example of a solid change, I’m speaking from a PvE perspective, why can’t camouflage be used in combat?, give it a 2% max hp heal for 10 seconds but then brings added utility to dodge mechanics like rogues and shadowmeld.
It can be used in so many instances to cheese mechanics, which everyone would love, so much added Utility and if not able to it becomes a pseudo heal. Essentially another defensive.
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