How to fix/improve the Orcs

Lore Story Forum
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Although, I primarily play Alliance, my main Horde toon is an Orc warrior. Since WoD, and the height of so-called “orc fatigue”, I feel like the Orc story/experience has gone even more downhill.

The Orcs are lacking in A list characters. They have lost several characters over the last period of time with few/no replacements.

More fundamentally, the Orc story has all but vanished from the game. Sure, you still see lots of Orcs around, but, at this point, they are more like Horde wallpaper than an actual Horde race with its own goals, ambitions and story.

Before continuing, I will stipulate that the same arguments can be made for other races. My point isn’t that Orcs have it “worse” than anyone else or something like that. My point is that this is a race who I am interested in and would like to see some improvements to going forward.

What, then, can be done to improve the Orc story in WoW? A few suggestions:

a) Develop some of the existing Orc B list characters and elevate them to A level and make them prominent parts of the story. This can include characters like Gorgonna, Jorin Deadeye, and Nazgrel. I am sure that there are many others who could be named.

b)Reintegrate the Frostwolves more fully into the Orc/Horde story. The Frostwolf thread has been left hanging since Cataclysm. With Garrosh and Sylvanas gone, either Thrall should reach out or the Frostwolves (Palkar or Galvangar?) should reach out and mend fences between the Horde and the Frostwolves.

c)Give the Orcs a role in the Horde going forward. Traditionally the role of the Orcs was to be the bulk of the Horde military and in the forefront of every campaign. However, since MoP, that role has more often been filled by either the Blood Elves or the Forsaken. It leaves the Orcs needing a new role in the Horde. My proposal would be that the Orcs assume the role of the guardian of the Horde’s honor - an elite force (Give it a name other Kor’kron since that has been somewhat tainted by events) dedicated to protecting the Horde from all enemies external and internal.

I am sure that there are other ideas for improving the Orcs and their role in the Horde. I look forward to seeing what other people think.

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That all sounds good (I’ve been wanting to see more of Jorin ever since BC), but like with the Night Elves, SL isn’t really going to be a good venue to accomplish that.

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I feel like one of the chief things they have to do is come up with a story for the orcs that don’t involve some sort of redemption arc or reliving the good ol’ days of the First and Second War.

The less they latch on to those powder kegs the better, in my personal opinion.

For example, the orcs on Azeroth now, for the first time since the Rise of the Horde, are free to shape their own future without a warchief. What will they do now? The clans aren’t as autonomous as they were back on Draenor. There are other people as part of the Horde.

Figure out how where to take their story, then they could plug in or create new characters to meet that narrative path.

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Honestly I don’t know what could really be done to fix the Orcs.

We were told they were only bad because of Demon Blood, WoD proved that even without it they’re easily swayed into war for the hell of it.

Wc3 was the perfect time to restart for the orcs, BC added new orcs to help with that new start but…you know mop happened and tainted the orcs again.

I think they’d need a pretty complete overhaul new characters from a new generation, don’t put the past on a pedestal, don’t be so possibly gung-ho about Honor if it’s so wildly different for all of them etc.

Orcs have the same problem as the rest of the Horde cast, they need a point like WC3 to break away and be like “That was the old Horde, the new Horde is different and good” but, I don’t see that happening any time soon.

Also, different characters with different views on how the race should progress that seems natural would be nice, Going from Thralls more shamanistic ways to Garrosh’s warriors ways is a understandable transition, maybe find a balance instead of just jumping from one deep end to another.

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You make a good point about how WoD wrecked what we had been told about the Orcs before that. Since, we are stuck with that now, maybe they could use that as a jumping off point for the Orcs finding a new path. i.e. The younger generation of Azeroth Orcs seeing what happened in WoD causes them to reassess some of what they may have been told by their elders and try and chart a new course.

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This is a tough one. The Orc’s racial fantasy, like most of the Horde races, is in pretty bad shape. Their roster really could use some TLC, and we need a very strong reconnection to both the WC3 and BC roots. Which will serve double to further culturally differentiate the MU Orcs from the AU Mag’har, as the entire novelty of having the AU branch is they bring a “new” twist of Orc culture into the Faction. Its not their appearance alone that gives the “AU” value.

Personally, with Outlands continuing to decay, maybe its time to get back to that collapsing world and start evacuating? Have Rexxar play a part in bringing the Mok’Nathal into the “MU Orcs” roster, even if only as a NPC race. Bring Nazgrel back to help characters like Jorin Deadeye convince the remaining Orcish clans that can be reasoned with to start making that migration. Perhaps have Thrall work with Greatmother Geyah and Drek’thar to try to salvage the Throne of the Elements.

Outside of that, it might be nice to have some stories that allow for Durotar and the Barrens to be turned into a bit more of a prosperous landscape. A new Nagrand. Have the Orcs find solutions for the water and food supply issues they’ve been plagued with since they made Orgrimmar. Have them really settle those regions, and make them more self sustaining. It may require “Horde as a whole” imput, but surely between all our assets we can figure something out for them.

EDIT: And yes, it would also be nice to advance and revisit the MU Frostwolves storyline as well. Have the Durotar Orcs really reconnect to them, while also have quests revolving how the Frostwolves have truly claimed and turned Alterac into their new homes.

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It is a good way to at least start talking about it.

Orcs suffered a lot, constant villain bat, loss of characters and very unfavorable portrayal of majority of orcish clans. There is lack of novelty to them anymore.

First some older characters that were likeable needs to be dusted off.

  1. Nazgrel, Jorin Deadeye and Gorgonna should return.

  2. To establish their politics/ needs/ and how they’re expanding now as a nation. Did they get any experience from Draenor? Are they going to cultivate some new practices? Revision of what clans are currently in the Horde and what their politics/ characteristics are now.

  3. Definition of orcish honor - to finally get a clarification

  4. A proper insight into warrior culture. Give them an edge back again.
    Edit: For clarification. One of the Warrior culture definitions should be to aspire to take on foe equal or bigger than you, and attacking weaker and defenceless as act of cowardice.

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Fixing orcs? You mean their posture I supposed, nothing else needs fixing since they are basically Horde humans.

So chiropracticly thinking have them hanging from chains on their wrists in a wardens dungeon for a few decades should fix that problem.

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Again.

How is Blizzard going to accomplish that in an expansion primarily focused on the lands of the dead with minimal engagement in Azeroth?

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WoD seemed to really screw with Orc lore. The Mag’Har in Outland are definitely plenty rough and tumble and Garrosh proved they didn’t need demon influence to have their blood type be zero chill. But they seemed pretty reasonable overall and not any crazier than most factions you interact with.

But in WoD and BFA the Mag’Har are more blood thirsty than the green orcs which is bewildering. Seems like Mannoroth’s Monster Energy if anything calmed them down in the long run. Seriously Grey’ah, despite just arriving here and having zero nuanced understanding of the political strife she and her people have just waded knee deep into, immediately goes full Banshee Queen fan girl for no other reason than;

“Violence is rad!”

I did really like Thrall’s presentation in SR though. Last time I really saw Thrall was in Wrath and I guess things got weird between then and Legion but he was very much the Warchief I fondly remembered in that book.

Not a warmonger, not rude, but not a pushover and not one to back down from a fight. I loved how he was the only one who didnt skulk away from Tyrande and quietly thought Anduin looked like a pink boy in ill fitting armor. Not a blood crazed prick - but also completely unphased by the prospect of a fight.

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The Orcs’ role within the Horde is the same as it’s ever been: they’re the main characters. Everyone else is there to be a foil.

Even the Undead only took center stage for a few minutes so that the Orcs’ long history of gleeful genocide could be overshadowed by something arguably worse.

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Funnyly even after Sylvanas took over it was just mostly orcs.
Except for Darkshore you have seen little Forsaken involved in anything major. Let alone other races.

It is so frustrating that blizzard is unable to think outside of orcs and humans.

Which is why I would love to see Horde and Alliance disbanded. Since both factions are just Humans vs Orcs all over with their idiotic sidekicks.

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Failing that, just dial the clock back to WC3 and have the lesson actually stick. It was such a good ending/new beginning for the race. Their abysmal handling of the orcs in Wrath through WoD was a massive disservice to that.

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I’d be ok with Drek’thar as Warchief.

Seeing him in his little wooden wheelchair with a tartan blanket over his lap would make me bend the knee without question.

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Like Blizzard reads the story forums xD. These forums are for us to speculate, and we can speculate anything we want anytime.

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I was also thinking about this is as well.

When it comes to developing characters its always a good idea to place NPCs in charge of certain story arcs. For example, we need some fresh faces from the MU Orc roster? I can’t think of a better person to get development and act as a mentor than Eitrigg. We need to find some way to transition the Throne of the Elements (or at least the elementals) into Durotar? Need Drek’thar and the Frostwolves to aid with that? Thrall and Greatmother Geyah are great for that, and tie that effort to transition that sacred site into how we make the Barrens and Durotar fertile. Need to evacuate the remaining sane tribes of outlands? Well, Nazgrel, Rexxar, and Jorin have you covered! In short, need to give a lot of attention to multiple characters? Simply doll out tasks.

As for the AU Mag’har, since I really doubt they are ever going to be able to return home, and I fully expect more of their peoples to migrate to Azeroth. Maybe its time to find a place for them? I would also guess that a VERY tortured Grom and AU Warchief Draka will join that roster at some point. I get that idea of allowing some territory shift is uncomfortable for the NEs right now, but the Kalimdor Horde is trying to support 5 different communities in a very small amount of territory. All of which is some of the harshest on all of Azeroth. So, Dustwallow Marsh, Stonetalon, and Desolace could really help. And parts of Faralas if we could get them. Not just for the Orcs either, but the Tauren and Trolls especially. We need some damned breathing room.

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How about starting with an NPC that isn’t an embarrassment.

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Look out everybody, it’s the people who lack reading comprehension!

If I may point to OP:

Take your whining to another thread where it might be more on-topic.

In my personal opinion, I think it’d be good to just get some more varied representation of the orcs that doesn’t center around war, violence, ““honor””, or redemption. I think a wonderful way to flesh the orcs out and make them more sympathetic would be to show how their culture might reflect on orcs who AREN’T soldiers, warriors, or whatever.

When we look at human representation, for example, we see a huge variety of people: mages, soldiers, lumberjacks, squires, priests, marksmen, farmers, peasants, the list goes on, all throughout many different zones. Many Alliance questgivers feel like real people with livelihoods and families, whereas many orc questgivers are just soldiers at outposts or warrior guys in camps.

In the case of humans, we get small moments with seemingly random NPCs that nevertheless establish a very deep connection between the player and that NPC, such as that human widow weeping over coffins in the Stormwind harbor after the Siege of Lordaeron. How often do we see an orc truly vulnerable like that? I think focusing more on the side of orc society that is (for lack of a better term) more human could do so much to flesh them out and make them more believable as a culture and society.

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I think orcs need to be written to have human flaws and emotions instead of being just an aesthetic.

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Look out there is that person who is just a jerk for being one.
Gosh how boring… you seem to lack cognitive comprehension by not understanding the fact that this is my personal opinion which happens to be similar.

I wonder why all the horde players have to be jerks all the time… but well if you chose to play genocidial maniacs, massmurderers and people killing children you have to be a bad person in RL aswell I guess.

1 Like