How to fix the Skill Cap in Arena

PVP Arenas
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WOW Arena has gotta be the most difficult pvp system I’ve ever seen. On the outside it seems simple, use your abilities wisely and win. Not so simple… Between multitasking, LOS, watching your players, enemy player, cooldown usage, cc chains etc can be a pain.

I believe that the problem is, were not getting new pvp players that would be bridging the gap, instead you have veteran pvpers and a number that dabble.
new players get stomped and quit or don’t see the worth and leave.

I think we have come a long way with the new incentives, but then we do silliness like reduce the item drops. Lets get some new blood in the arena freshen it up a bit, spread the ladder a little.

Thoughts?

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Thoughts ?

Try practice.

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In this generation? Lmao not gunna happen.

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Right lol. Should just start the game with glad title.

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I think a massive problem with this game at an introductory level as far as pvp goes is the constant up’s and down’s of classes. You can roll your first class and have it be total garbage by time you hit 120 as far as balance goes. Then magically 3 weeks later it can be the best. What a coincidence that every single game now has a monk healer.

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The title isn’t “Help Me” the titles is how do we bring more people in and spread the wealth.

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“WOW Arena has gotta be the most difficult pvp system I’ve ever seen. On the outside it seems simple, use your abilities wisely and win. Not so simple… Between multitasking, LOS, watching your players, enemy player, cooldown usage, cc chains etc can be a pain.”

Practice. Lol then this goes away. That’s the thoughts. Mcsmitty would you like your free glad title as well :slight_smile:

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Yea Dem, balance will always be a back and forth game for sure. I don’t think well ever have a true fix to the flavor of the month classes/specs. That can knock people down too with a bad taste for pvp.

Maybe if they still accumulate conquest for gearing up, but that opens up people just queing and surrendering.

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Sounds like you want to dumb the game down to make it easier for new people to start. All that’s going to do is push away a core base to attract new people. And let’s be honest, isn’t going to happen in this old game.

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he’s not asking for that, he’s saying that we need more pvp’ers joining the bottom end of the ladder which is true, the barrier of entry is pretty high without good incentives to cross it

you casually saying ‘git gud’ (which ironically you could use a dose of yourself) doesn’t really solve the issue

having decent gear drops with some control over traits would go a long way

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Suifeng- I met my goals, got my transmog and made some good bro’s. The problem is our system plus the veteran pvpers make it a difficult game mode to just “walk in”. I think that puts people off a bit.

EFX- Dumb it down? no, Just want more people to get involved see the fun it can bring, fresh blood good times decent rewards (haha). I think they did good with changes this season, but I think we need a bit more incentive.

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Want to add some new pvp players?

Add vendors so people can see rewards they would like to aquire and they will participate to earn those rewards. Its not a mystery.

Sadly, Blizzard thinks random=fun.

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They don’t think random=fun. Activision thinks that random = more $$$ and time played because it keeps their players on a tortuous hamster wheel.

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Thing is overall specific skill caps for classes have been lowered, and really what ends up becoming more prominent is team skill, which is actually a little bit more overwhelming anyways for a newer player because you have less control over outcomes than you could have in the past. I think BfA for some specs has improved this, the game isn’t entirely scripted and you can have different playstyles and approaches.

Overall I think it would just be good to still make it so you have a reason for experienced players to want to keep separating and improving themselves, but the resources for newer players could actually be better. Take for example, League of Legends. There’s a lot of overwhelming information if you’re a newer player. There’s actually so much that you have to learn. But there is tons of information out there that helps you learn how to play, and as such it makes the newer player experience a lot smoother. It makes experienced players satisfied when there are still skillful characters they can play and improve upon, and newer players also can get information, jump in on a basic character and play. The really complicated things don’t end up mattering too much when you’re newer.

But I think that with PvP how some classes have become so reliant on other classes because you are not whole on your own, it actually does make it so that you need to know a lot more than you normally would need to. A good example is pruned DR categories. In xpacs like WoTLK it would be really rare that your CC DR’d with another class, your CC usually DR’d with yourself outside of some edge cases. Fear and Clone were on different DRs, some classes had stuns, some had horrors which were pretty similar to stuns but on a different DR and longer CD, others had different types of CCs. You could play with whatever class and be relatively fine especially if you were a newer player because this entire concept of having to play a specific comp because of DR sharing didn’t matter much.

Compare that DR situation with nowadays, fear and clone are on the same DR, horror is on polymorph DR (and the only one is death coil from warlocks since priest horror became a stun), and almost every class has access to a stun. Way more DR categories are condensed, like DB being on fear and clone DR as well etc.

This makes it so that if you’re a newer player you actually really have to learn more about comps because the control you have over a game that you might have saw your class had on your own, now has to be used entirely differently and with specific classes making that learning curve a bit steeper. I really think when “pruning” was done it should have been in the form of still giving people really high utility and abilities, but they should actually be different types instead of condensed. MoP had these issues where classes weren’t really pruned yet but then they all had stuns… and instead of toning down some of those extra abilities they got that maybe weren’t necessary such as Wyvern Sting for ranged hunters, and Asphixiate for DKs, they got rid of other abilities instead.

I used to think it was cool that as a hunter I didn’t have an interrupt, or a stun (minus monkey stun), but I had silencing shot and scatter trapping as instant CCs. Or a DK would have Strangulate and their only stun was pet gnaw. DKs don’t even have Strangulate anymore. I found WoTLK ret interesting in that they just had HoJ and Instant Rep as CCs, but no interrup and different types of utilities instead to make up for them not having an interrupt. There were so many more types of utilities and it was more complex… yet at the same time it was actually better for a newer player because you could pretty easily grasp “Oh I can try to control this person or just try to use this ability for this situation”, and it wasn’t as confusing.

TL;DR New player experience can be improved by giving back unique utility and actually going back on some DR changes (but giving people different types of CC again), and also just having better info out there for newer players to learn from.

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He’s asking for the game to be easier. All I’m saying is practice, people need to learn to practice. That’s literally all.

Is it really hard to expect someone to learn a product they are using ?

Incentives to play ? Like really ? Practice to win and be better.

Not trying to hate on anyone, I have no rating to back up anything. But I also don’t expect things to be made more casual friendly.

If I want to be good at something I practice to win. I guess that’s changed in our society. So basically we now have a debate about sociology.

Just have a good day all and go back to thinking of ideas to make things easier and more incentives for new players.

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Try suggesting removing rebuke for instant rep and old utility back in the paladin forums or GD, you’ll get eaten alive lol

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I mean they don’t exactly have to do a change like that, it was mostly just as an example of things that could help. Having the interrupts on every class is more manageable I think than other issues like the stuns being everywhere imo.

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That may be the resolution, I would agree; however, the problem is that the new people won’t be committed to learning and trying to improve so they’ll quit and/or come here and make some of the threads we’ve been seeing lately about too much CC, too much to learn.

It’s a problem that stems from the direction WoW has been taking for years but also I’d claim it to be a generational issue (which is why WoW is the way it is now). People aren’t willing to grind to try to get better and accept mediocrity in their performance until they get good. Myself, I’m not very good at PvP but I enjoy trying to learn and improve so I’ll come back for my meager rating each season. I enjoy the challenge and seeing the mechanical differences in my play through effort, research, trial and error. I would wager a massive portion of the people still subscribed to WoW are not of that mindset. They want results, gear, titles, mounts and they want them now.

When you try to appeal to a casual audience in a MMO you lose the people who will actually stick around and play your game long term and the casuals end up quitting anyways because they can’t commit to the game just like they can’t commit to anything else in their lives.

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100% agree it’s a generation issue

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I think the biggest difference pre legions versus post legion is that before prelegion class design, you could legit carry the skill gap was so big.

really nowadays there isnt really such a thing as carrying. Not to the extent you could in cata/mop/wod. It is much more team based now, which is why this game can get really frustrating for new players, because they actually dont have that much control.

Ya cant heal forever if the dps cant land a kill by executing good CC chains.

Your not gonna land a kill running cupid if the ret always hojes the dps or the hunter cant land a trap.

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