…did you write THE RISE OF SKYWALKER?..
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You wish. But if you have better suggestions to get everything out of this hole i’m all ears.
I’m with you and I hope so. I really do. It’s why scenarios involving time travel and redefining the number of dead have been proposed.
I absolutely agree I do not want to see a storyline where “Suddenly, Anduin decides xenophobia is a good idea.” It would be stupid.
I don’t believe that does anything to fix the narrative going forward. My ideal version is that (pending some way to balance the ledger) the Horde is portrayed as a faction of “anti-heroes” while the Alliance is “righteous heroes.”
Those may not be the correct terms, but as a couple of (highly modified examples):
IF the Culling of Stratholme would stop the spread of the plague in the Eastern Kingdom, the question would be whether it’s justified to slaughter many (some who may not be infected) to save more. The Alliance would reject this - the Horde would accept this.
IF the “super blight” would kill the Lich King, but it would take a large force to draw him out and most would be killed in the damage, with the other option being a longer drawn out fight that cost more lives over time eventually taking Icecrown via conventional means, the Horde might support that but the Alliance would not.
Please bear with these examples as I know they aren’t great and they’re somewhat off the top of my head. But the underlying concept would be that the Horde would take a different path than the Alliance but at least have some justification. The disagreements would cause tension and friction, and we could argue all day about which position was better, but at least the Horde would have a leg to stand on. Right now, we honestly don’t.
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Yep, I don’t know why Blizzard wants to cather everyone at the same time with a captain america alliance while also make them have facist questlines and points of view and the Horde jumping from Genocide to “Sorry I didn’t mean to do that”. Let at the very least a huge in-game poll to ask what the playerbase want instead of making us eye roll to 360° every single time
Time travel shenanigans may be a narrative cop out, but we help Chromie prevent her own death so why not?
Because at what point does absolutely nothing matter?
Here’s an idea- no one died, EVER. They were all just hiding. Really, really, well. Sylvannas just pretended to kill them really, really well. For… reasons!
It’s possible, if you just expand the lore for it to be possible! It’s easy to write, if you just throw the very concept of narrative consequences into the garbage, then set the garbage on fire!
BFA happening was stupid, but it wasn’t THAT stupid. I honestly believe that there is no ‘good’ fix for BFA because the writers went too far and painted themselves into a corner and we’re just going to have to accept that there will NOT BE a ‘satisfying’ conclusion, at least not one that satisfies everyone or even a majority of us, but that is still better than a complete ASSPULL that negates the value of everything that came before. That’s the absolute WORST way forward IMO. The Alliance completely genociding the Horde is better to me. The Horde rejecting ‘redemption’ and fully embracing pure evil is better to me.
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So Afrasiabi was the ONLY Horde main at the executive level of World of Warcraft lol
Curious, Afrasiabi was the only Blizz Executive from the Global South and appears to have been the only Blizz executive who mains Horde.
Strange!
Intriguing!
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On the one hand, I have dismissed it when people have crowed about BFA needing to have consequences because I feel a) that my investment has been “consequenced” right out of the story and b) because that commentary normally doesn’t come from fans of playable races that actually suffered consequences from BFA. But, this commentary is on point.
I’ll also add though - and this is mostly to Morghel - just undoing it, going back in time, retconning it, pretending that it didn’t happen, trying to hide it from view, or otherwise not dealing with it doesn’t fix the issue. Blizzard did it. The audience is aware of it. You can’t unring the bell here.
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Danuser? (Played forsaken), Affrasabi, Kosak, Samwise, all of them played horde, or still play horde.
Playing a maining are two separate thing. I play Alliance, but I do not main Alliance.
all of them are/were main hordes…you know, btw. ion play a horde-shaman as main
Citation needed (as always) that they mained Horde
I can even find you the character of Ion 
I don’t know the characters of Cossack and Danuser, nor of Samwise, but kosak himself was the one who admitted that because he liked Horde too much he preferred them in Cata and that’s why the letter of apology.
Danuser is the big Sylvanas/nathanos fan…and once told something about an undead (character unknown).
and samwise is an orc player, but this character is also unknown to me.
…can you find any evidence proving whose character that is?
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Honestly? That’s pretty much all you’re really left with.
I dislike time travel and I am loathe to suggest hitting ctrl-z on an entire expansion (let alone decade). I find it a cheap tactic and terrible for the player base.
But take an honest look at JUST the storyline from the end of cataclysm through BfA and tell me why I wouldn’t consider the Horde the villains of the story.
You have our leader - Garrosh - being a xenophobic genocidal corrupt monster. Then he time travels and makes our entire founding race evil to the point of even knowing the consequences (sort of) and still drinking demon blood.
Then the Legion invades and the Horde … basically twiddles their thumbs. The Horde even start by abandoning the overwhelmed Alliance (though honestly it’s probably the right decision). Malfurion (and somewhat Tyrande) fights off the empowered Emerald Nightmare. The future AR Nightborne fight off … the evil within their own race that is supporting the demons! Odyn … exists … yeah that one isn’t really relevant either way. Meanwhile Khadgar shepherds us through this fight, aided by Velen, then Turalyon, and of course Lord Illidan (but while his story is tied to the Night Elves, he’s his own faction).
Then we jump into BfA where our initial actions directly result in the destruction of two cities including our own (in fairness it was under siege so we destroyed it). Our future AR current (but soon to be dead) leader decides to bind himself and his line to the Loa of Death. Oh and our leader makes secret pacts with basically everyone evil she can find that isn’t a real or faux Old God. Then it turns out she is working with literally, not figuratively, the most evil person in the Realm of Death, who is literally ruling over a domain that twists and destroys souls. And she’s been working with him for a decade. And everything in BfA was designed to help send souls to empower him.
It’s hard to spin that into anything else besides the villain in the story.
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It’s Kosak, not Cossack.
If you’re going to talk about my white whale, do it properly.
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…can you find any evidence proving whose character that is?
It is his own guild? It is not unknown that he is this character.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eczxxR7hnkQ&feature=youtu.be
start listening
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You linked a character page straight from the site.
That literally only proves:
- That the character exists
- Whose guild it’s in
- Stats, gear, raid progress, etc.
It’s not unknown by the guild? Ok, great!
That doesn’t make it common knowledge, so maybe tone down the arrogance, just a little? 
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I’m not sure the common knowledge point is really what matters here. The point has to do with the proclivities that the writers have, and the extent to which it biases their decisions.
Case in point - Kosak. The guy admitted he identified more with the Horde in his Dev watercooler. He was famous for writing a pair of comics where he presented stereotypes of Alliance, and later Horde characters - comics that were extremely uncharitable to the Night Elves, and comics that featured the Horde characters killing off the Alliance ones. He established the “Hero Factory” model as a reply to Alliance concerns about bias, effectively stating that yes, they were biased, but that was because “suffering drives our story engine” and provides room for the hero to rise. If that doesn’t look familiar to you yet, that’s BFA’s engine - and his response to the Alliance.
On the whole? I think we’re still dealing with a lot of Warcraft II fans in the development team, who are writing according to those biases with predictable results. So, in that sense? Yes, their proclivities and preferences matter - and they’re hurting both sides.
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Right, but that was my point—that’s how we know what his “proclivities,” as you put it, are.
Linking a random character sheet and claiming it’s a Blizzard executive…doesn’t prove it’s a Blizzard executive.
Or if it does, lemme link one of my characters to “prove” I’m really Jeff Bezos 
Or even worse, people who came in circa-Cataclysm - Mists of Pandaria, and thus have no knowledge of any of the old Warcraft games, certainly not Reign of Chaos.
All they see is the faction conflict, Lord of the Rings-style.