I appreciate that you’ve put a great deal of effort into rebuilding them that doesn’t involve trying to either retcon the Fourth War or take stuff from the Alliance.
2 Likes
I feel like so many of our discussions always boil down to “what you classify as Alliance”. Like, I would not classify the Kalimdor territories south of Ashenvale as “Alliance zones”. If anything, they were once Tauren territories. Dustwallow, Thousand Needles, Tanaris, and Stonetalon already hold several Horde race offshoot settlements (Goblin, Troll, Tauren, and even Ogre in one case). Desolace is THE Ancestral Tauren land that just needs to be healed. Feralas holds a single NE military base, and Tauren settlements. Ungoro holds noone. So … for me, “Taking from the Alliance” doesn’t really factor on Kali, because I don’t want/care about NE zones.
Its on EK were these things become more hazy. I see the Hinterlands as the one last bastion of Ancestral Forest Troll land they have. Aerie Peak is relatively new, and if Magni is right the Wildhammer’s Grim Batol, the Wetlands, and the Highlands can all be reclaimed and cleansed now. The Frostwolves have held Alterac for all of Warcraft, and Alterac was a dead Kingdom even before the Scourge. The Forsaken (like it or not) are the ONLY playable people of Lordaeron in the Game, so I see no reason why they should not keep/claim the once lands of Lordaeron. Especially if Calia Menethil decides to back their claim, as she is the heir to that Kingdom.
9 Likes
Says the Alliance fanatical poster who is still salty over not getting exclusive ownership at the game´s story direction. 
. Let me tell you two things:
- You can absolutely demand “Horde faction stays stuck in Maw esque place so muh Azeroth stays in muh glorious fav faction´s hands” one dimensional plots if you -as a supposedly actual considerate adult- are willing to pay the price A.K.A. you guys pay the subs, we go F2P. That way you can get absolute authonomy on the narrative direction of this game -say if the “faction NPCs” all literally “go to hell and stay there” while the Horde PCs have to become 24/7 - 365 time accesories for the Alliance faction, then me thinks that, considering my game will absolutely cease to take my PC´s identity in importance ever again while it dedicates to stroke the egos of the Alliance fanatics cause no serious Alliance player / poster would ever consider this “brillian idea”, then the less devs can do is remove my monetary contribution considering they won´t be selling me a ROLE PLAYING experience, merely a playing one-.
Aaaand in the case previous choice fails, then:
- Try to keep the -very much guaranteed- QQ at the nonexistant level when the Horde story (by proxy of becoming heavily focused) gets a huge portion of the resources in cinematics, arts, etc. -I mean we Hordies would have this whole new story about “How the Horde fights and survives and maybe even escapes” Maw 2.0 while you guys get the superb story about rebuilding your houses and idk… watch paint dry? ( I mean, considering your faction´s narrative absolutely FORBIDS for anyone to oppose the Commandments of the Wrynn empire so…)
Btw… bold of you to talk about “make me feel big and strong again, even if it means lying to me” when THIS is LITERALLY the M.O. of the writers regarding any remotely morally questionable action taken by any Alliance / Alliance flavored character / race in this game. Have you ever though that maybe some Hordies are asking EXACTLY THIS precisely cause they´re tired of their fav faction being subjected to a much harsher set of requirements and a much much harder set of rules than “lul, nuthing happened here!!” like it usually happens for your faction´s naughty characters?-
Tl;dr: If you aren´t an actual Horde fan/poster interested in getting decent content involving your faction that can be classified in anything different to “NEFPA / MHP superiority complex fantasies”, then maybe this isn´t the thread for you? Go make your own thread full of all those sadistic ideas you have in mind, exorcise those demons and move on?
12 Likes
You can keep insisting this until you’re blue in the face but not only is is a transparent desire for Horde imperialism (you know, the “redeeming” kind, I guess) but it’s also a moot point since the Horde lost the Fourth War in the Eastern Kingdoms and them returning, particularly to the extent that you envision, is tantamount to retconning the Fourth War.
So when your ideas for “redeeming/rebuilding” the Horde come down to “let’s retcon the Alliance’s victories in BfA and subjugate numerous Alliance and independent factions to Horde interests in order to enable a glorious land-grab” I’m going to object to them, especially when you have the temerity to claim that the Horde doing this doesn’t infringe on the Alliance in any way. Especially when your justification for doing this at all is reliant on dismissing or minimizing the Alliance’s heritage, particularly as far as places like Lordaeron are confirmed.
It really cheapens your insistence that you want the Horde to develop independently of anything to do with the Alliance. And it suggests that you believe that the Horde is so narratively bankrupt that the only way for them to develop is by material land grabs, as though that is a substitute for depth.
The way I figure it, if the roles were reversed, the Alliance wouldn’t want the Horde players dictating how their story should go.
Perhaps block the poster? No? Okay.
1 Like
That hasn’t really stopped the Horde from trying to dictate how the Alliance’s story should go even in the story that we have.
I don’t have to because according to “Exploring Azeroth: The Eastern Kingdoms” … Blizz already “retconned” your supposed victories in BfA. In that “Tirisfal Glades once again belongs to the Forsaken according to the report Shaw made for Anduin after the end of the fourth war.” And as the Sepulcher is also still held by the Forsaken, this would mean that the Northern Part of Silverpine is at least also still held by them as well.
EDIT: Sounds like you’re picking up Arathi at least. And probably Hillsbrad, Gilneas and Southern SP.
12 Likes
It´s the “redemption” deffinition used to portray your Alliance faction to you Alliance fan, happens all and every time with all and every morally dark action (regardless of size, in matters of amorality size doesn´t matter). So the way I see it is “if it´s acceptable for you, then it´s acceptable for me”.
The Horde faction for the Horde players certainly MUST NOT continue to be portrayed as a downgraded disaster that ended up as the Alliance welfare imitation like it happened in BfA cause it did nothing but aggravate us Horde players while you people STILL believe this wasn´t “good enough”, ergo why should we Horde players continue to feel annoyed over your kind´s impossible standards? Not even the misery of fellow players was “good enough” for you, ergo NOTHING will be. And trying to waste time and effort in this is a fool´s errand.
Remembering Gantrithor´s VERY famous -and popular- post on Kyalin´s thread: the Horde is it´s own thing and has to be a good thing for the people playing it, and if this isn´t likeable for either Alliance NPC´s or players, then these can pound sand, period.
Maybe some of us we just want to be left alone? No seriously, even the “Go to Hell” not funny at all troll attempt could become an amazing story -especially cause this means no moar Blanduin, no moar Tragicmoore, no moar “muh Teldrassil / Theramore / Southshore / Lordaeron /insert non vague AND vague Alliance territory claim” and a miriad other bothersome cries I´ve had to stand since Vanilla. And it would guarantee 100% dedication to Horde only characters in my Horde only toons, but I suspect this is NOT what the Dwarf actually means.
Stop wasting time with him and continue with the prerrogative: the Horde redemption as seen in the Horde eyes, Alliance fanatics can worry over their own business instead of trying to become “the Sun” of this game.
2 Likes
I assume you’re referring to this page?
Shaw doesn’t say that the Forsaken control it, he says that they claim it. His use of the word “belongs” could suggest that it was granted to them by the terms of the armistice, but that raises the question of where exactly in Tirisfal Glades the Forsaken are given that every major settlement was destroyed and can’t be rebuilt because it’s still plagued. Do you imagine the Forsaken going on a conquering spree from that crypt in Deathknell?
Some WoWpedia editor seems to have gotten a bit eager. And Anduin choosing to let them stay under Calia’s watch is a far cry from the Forsaken and Trolls taking control of everything north of Stromgarde as well, as you envision.
Again, you want the Horde losing the Fourth War to somehow translate into the Horde gaining large amounts of territory and I’m not sure how this can be interpreted as anything else but pure unadulterated salt.
I can understand this and it will be a part of my hypothetical.
2 Likes
Stop entertaining the short and stocky troll, Droité. His recent contribution to the thread was about literally sequestrating half of the game into hell, just to backpedal when people pressured over explaining himself in an actual coherent way and then to try -and still fail- butter Gantrithor while at the same time he lowkey complained Gan´s proposal is NOT following the “redemption requierements” HE wants.
Me thinks he´s in the wrong place and while the forums as a free media must consider his opinion, it´s but useless in this thread as long as it´s OCD focused in “MUH Alliance favored deffinition of redemption that HAS TO HAPPEN”.
I know… and basically it kinda has to be this way imho. Bfa made too much damage, and made the potential interactions between characters inter factions either cartoonishly aggresive or cartoonishly ridiculous. That expac made me lowkey detest and feel disgusted by the mere interaction with members of the opposing faction (and not by their “actions” but by the way the freaking writters coddle them so obtusely so they can continue to suplant and block ad nauseaum the characters I actually want to interact with).
You know I´m a firm believer in not seeing, hearing or knowing of any Alliance / formerly Alliance / Alliance flavored character ever again in at least a decade if not ever cause the interactions between both factions have left me -as a fan- with nothing but a handful of perma underdeveloped “heroes”, the villain bat in hilariously exagerated manner of former heroes and places I don´t care about… ergo: nothing.
6 Likes
We will take revenge, we will take revenge, and together you will die.
We will take revenge, we will take revenge on you, you will benefit.
But only the eclipse will pass - we will kill you, do not argue.
Peace will come again, peace, in the graves you will fall asleep.
Eerie songs celebrating the night elves’ revenge on the Horde.
Dude, I have told you and Zerde a billion times… if your gameplay experience sense of self is SO entrenched in the places, then get the whole freaking map -do send us to hell, no problem-, but afterwards don´t complain over we noty having to interact in any shape, way or form apart from old content with either YOU or YOUR faction, period.
Good luck getting interesting content that isn´t the n-esim Ode to the Wrynn - Proudmoore empire afterwards.
There is no horde in the world. The story is now only about Anduin and Jaina.
Did I understand your message correctly?
Also, when the Horde disappears, do I lose the right to complain about not interacting with the Horde?
Or was it something else that was meant?
“Don’t complain about us”? Or “Don’t send us complaints”?
Take it as you want dude, I quite remember your deliberate lack of seriousness on these threads.
Your problem, not mine. Go bother somone else.
1 Like
Why try to be serious if it doesn’t get the attention you need? The only “masterpiece” - the evil night elves attacking the Horde and the Alliance - was ignored (except for the standard “What the hell is this?” Reaction and a little comment from Zarin). There was also a little discussion with Droite about harming goblins.
“Absurd” is much more likely to bring discussions of any length. Yes, I was serious (exerted at least some mental effort) only two times, terrible sample. But I still won’t be able to create something attractive, so I’ll “live” on standard stimuli. It is more pleasant to be ridiculous and hated than unnoticed. Sigh.
Mda…
Thank’s.
I think some of issues is your translator. Many of your sentences are weird. I don’t know what you are saying most of the time. Maybe try a different translator if you can?
Most likely, the problem is in the construction of phrases and the selection of words. It is better to divide the sentence into many parts and use unambiguous verbs. And do not try to make hints, it still does not work.
Most likely the problem is in the construction of phrases and the selection of words. It is better to split the sentence into many parts and use unambiguous verbs. And not trying to make hints, it still does not work.
Not much difference. Which variant uses punctuation marks more correctly?
The second one is better. The words are almost identical but the last sentence is less awkward and easier to read. I am not sure this translator will be better for all sentences, but it can’t hurt to test it out for a few posts.