How Can We Redeem/Rebuild The Horde (Actual Horde Edition)

the dialogue for Forsaken NPC’s in Orgrimmar post Reckoning was pretty mixed, but the fear tactics the Horde used by marching Sylvanas loyalists through the capital quickly turned any discussions on the topic hushed.

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Hey now, they gutted warlock Demonology at the end of WoD to make way for demon hunters

Yelling was warranted :stuck_out_tongue:

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To be fair, it’s official lore that you guys did steal Metamorphosis. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

But like the old taco commercial went, “Why not both”? Let both classes have nice things.

:taco:

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I mean as mentioned, she could unite the undead and living of Lorderon but perhaps as a neutral leader although I can’t see how that would work…maybe like Shattrath? Where instead of a big glowing wind chime keeping the peace it’s her. I don’t know though.

It still blows my mind they outright said they didn’t want people to play it.

Though I am glad we got demon hunters out of it. They’re the only reason I stuck around after the changes to hunter.

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The impression I get is just them making sure to cover their butts legally to avoid accusations of them stealing ideas from their fans. I’m pretty sure lots of creators/creative companies are forbidden from reading their fan’s fictions. There was a whole kerfluffle in the Darkover fandom about that sort of thing.

https://fanlore.org/wiki/Marion_Zimmer_Bradley_Fanfiction_Controversy

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Xelnath (or to be fair, someone claiming to be him) once joined another forum I visit and mentioned a bit of backstory about his firing. Tl;dr from what I remember was that he was having a bad time IRL back then and was overworking to distract himself, which led to some burnout and frayed nerves. And last he said, things were improving for him and he was feeling much better at his new job.

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Anywho I like the idea of what Calia could be while not liking what she is

And I can only fault blizzard for that disconnect and for any narrative failure or disaster that may be on its way

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I think the real problem is facing prejudice against undead head on and no longer downplaying it. Blizzard has to take accountability and face the problem they wrote.

Chapter 26 of Before the Storm was good, having Alonsus Faol confront Turalyon about his undead bias and suggesting that Genn’s entire hatred of the Forsaken is based on the idea that he doesn’t seek justice he has to admit his son died for nothing, but we need that in game and on a grand scale.

The Alliance needs to be aware of their prejudice against the undead and feel terrible about it. (but seeing as how they chose to have the Scourge run rampant due in part to Sylvanas breaking the helm I don’t think that moment will come any time soon. I have mixed feelings about that narrative choice.)

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Part of the problem is that we are at a point in the story where too many potential future plot points and motivations have been completely stripped from characters to the point that it becomes homogenized and boring.

Genn no longer has a beef with Forsaken, there’s a future plot point dead. Turalyon no longer has a beef with Forsaken or Orcs, there’s a future plot point dead. Jaina no longer has a beef with the Horde and Lor’themar and the Blood Elves no longer have a beef with Jaina, more dead plot points that go nowhere.

Every character just ends up being a homogenized peace-loving mess which is called Anduinification and even if Blizzard kills off or corrupts Anduin in Shadowlands which I think is looking more and more likely, that doesn’t fix the problem of having every character still kind of being Anduin.

There should be more reasons for conflict, not fewer. Conflict is good. Conflict fuels storytelling. Conflict is what keeps WoW from being a Saturday Morning Cartoon about the Azeroth Avengers vs. the evil Space Octopuses.

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This is exactly why. There is a reason why I don’t read fan fiction anymore. Because now I have a writing career and I don’t want to take the chance.

And you’re right that it’s not just Blizzard. Any company with a similar product involving fiction and such will not allow its content creators to read anything created by fans.

I’m a Battletech fan. The creators working for Catalyst Game Labs frequent the message boards. They have stated more than once that anything created by the fans on the boards or anywhere cannot be used by them. The cannot even go into the subforums that allow for that. They had to deal with some lawsuit-happy moron that actually tried to take them to court over some supposed fan work he did and claimed it was stolen by the company.

It’s extremely rare for a company to look at a fan’s work and contact the creator to essentially buy their work. It actually happened with WOTC a number of years ago regarding a fanmade work for the Forgotten Realms setting. But only because somebody told them about it, one dev agreed to look at it, and thought it would be a great product.

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I agree, I don’t think peace between the Horde and Alliance is viable from a story perspective.

I think we need conflict to keep this story interesting.

It’s one of the things that really disappointed me about Legion; they took a HUGE plot of Sargeras and the Burning Legion and solved that whole problem in one expansion and what are we left with? The Jailer and then what? more Old Gods?
Void Lords?

Where do they go from here if they don’t introduce new sources of conflict?

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That can be walked back though, it’s recent and was only seen in a book.

Well we got confirmation Xera is maybe coming back since Naaru go back to The Light upon death

Xeralyon maybe hates the Forsaken and Orcs

This is like the fourth time though, sure the cha cha slide of her heart is exhausting but it’s not like blizzard hasn’t walked that back again

Maybe Rommath still has? Only Aethas and Lorthemar don’t.

Extreme Levels Of Doubt

oh but Jaina still has beef with Aethas doesn’t she?

i don’t remember that being resolved post Legion. I think we are still hiding the fact that the Council of Six let the Sunreavers back into Dalaran?

Shadows Rising set up for a conflict between Jaina and Alleria. I highly doubt Alleria is ‘over’ her hatred of the Horde, she still has deep rooted family trauma there.

I think there’s a lot of set up for the Alliance to become the aggressors in future expansions… the Alliance folks will Love that. (although it would be a funny parody on real life if instead of jewish space lasers causing forest fires in California, it was instead Lightforged Draenei using their spaceship canon to light Mulgore on fire. The air would smell absolutely delicious. :no_mouth: )

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Mostly agree with you except for here.

If we had a “Blizzcon predictions for the story” thread (which why don’t we?) I would predict that Anduin is getting corrupted.

When Blizzard marketed the Q&A look at what they said “call to the Light and you may be heard” with Holy Good Boy Anduin as the front and center framing. Quite sure they did that ironically because by the time we get to the Q&A Anduin as we know him will be gone (for now). And good riddance.

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Oooh so Light Crusade inbound? Maybe…?

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If you don’t make this I will. we can’t let Baal make it it would be too long winded.

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I have some theories about this. Let’s get that thread started!

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I’ll have you know my long winded threads are some of the most viewed on reddit and the Warlock forum!

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Depending on who you ask, the humans showed up and mostly just settled in the parts the Amani didn’t much care for (i.e. Tirisfal and its spookiness or the open plains of Arathi), and then the trolls decided to start butchering them because “They’re not us, so they gotta die”.
Likewise, they supposedly attacked the elves before they even made any kind of push towards what would be modern-day Quel’thalas because as it turns out, the Amani trolls aren’t nice people on average. “Diplomacy” isn’t really a common thing for a war-like people who think they’re in a position of power.

Now, would the elves and humans have played nice because the trolls didn’t attack them? Very likely not. This is WARCRAFT after all, and the whole game is based around killing people aren’t us based on the idea that they have stuff we want and they’re not going to give it up without getting killed.

You don’t get to police where people post, my chumbly wumbly apple crumble.

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