So since we got the Horde/Alliance borders out of the way (and those maps are awesome btw. Nearly perfect, outside of a few tiny adjustments on the SouthEastern End of Both Continents) … I figure I’ll just post my list of Core Race characters I’d like to see built up (even if not all of them get that attention). Including their leaders, since so many of them need build up too.
MU Orcs: Thrall, Eitrigg, Nazgrel, Jorin, Thura (for that new Blood), Rexxar.
Darkspear: Rokhan, Zekhan, Zen’tabra, “New Farraki Lead” (since I want Rokhan to work to bring them into the Horde, so build up a new fun Racial Lead for him to bounce off of).
MulgorTauren: Baine, Jevan, Aponi, Hamuul, Muln.
Forsaken: Voss, Tattersail, Belmont, Faranell, Velonara, Calia (IF Voss is built up as an equal counterpart and she’s given a personal motive to create some distance from the Alliance. Even if she does maintain positive relations with Anduin/Jaina). I have no idea whats going on with Delaryn.
Sin’dorei: Lor’themar, Liadrin, Rommath, Aethas, Halduron, Salandria (new Blood?).
Bilgewater: Gazlowe, Mida, Grapplehammer, Ricket, Neri Sharpfin (Since with Gazlowe as our Trade Prince we can bring the Unshackled in more a bit. We couldn’t justify that with Wix).
“Technically” not Genocidal, but definitely awful warmongers who committed War Crimes at least.
Even AU Grom I’m barely giving a “maybe” pass for the AU Mag’har down the road, because its clear by Hellscream he was supposed to be a more nuanced character than what we got in WoD. The fact that he (unlike alot of the AU Warlords) seemed to genuinely care about his people, and thought he was doing the right thing for them. Its been 30 years since the events of WoD. If he still alive, he is facing punishment by his once victims right now (if he didn’t face it before during those 30 years). And I do think it is important for Geya’rah’s development that she be at least allowed to save her mentor (and as many of her people as she can from the Lightbound forced-converts if they show up) … since she’s not going to be able to save her world.
In short, AU Grom is just about the ONLY AU Warlord I’d accept joining the Horde down the road. But ONLY because of the intent of his writing; his intent with his actions; Geya’rah’s needs; the time difference between the events of WoD; and the fact that if he is still alive he is facing direct judgement from his victims right now (and I hope an explanation of more of those consequences he faced in the fallout of WoD).
How does fighting angry Night Elves who want to strike back at them for past injustices help the Horde to “deal with” the “stain of BfA,” though? That’s what I’m genuinely not seeing.
(Again: I know how it helps the Alliance/Night Elves. I’m only asking how it helps the Horde. What positive developments for the Horde do you see coming out of this? --And I don’t mean the list that you posted earlier; those are things that could happen with or without fighting angry Night Elves, and none are specifically tied to the recovering from BfA. I want to know how fighting Night Elves specifically helps the Horde, in your view.)
And don’t forgot Ariok. Eitrigg son who helped us in Draenor and who is now a dire orc. Unfortunately, blizzard also seem to have forget about him and we still don’t know what happened to him since Wod.
I am still hoping for gilgoblin to be a allied race so i don’t want Neri to be part of the Bilgewater.
I mean we all want to play those big race but we all know the reason they aren’t playable. So as long as we don’t have any solution to make them fit through door without just making them tauren size, they won’t happen.
And as much as i don’t like small race that much, adding so much tall race who all end up 10feet tall just make the previous tall race feel like they aren’t that tall at the end. Plus, gilgoblin would be the only small race in the horde that i would be ready to play.
The night elves alone have more leaders then all Horde core races combined. There is a huge disparity. And this needs to be fixed. For that the OG Horde heroes need to return from the dead. Only that way the Horde can be properly made great again.
The Alliance would still need the western part of Stonetalon, Desolace down to Feralas as a territory (western Feralas).
The Horde gets the narrow area in Ashenvale and I think that makes it technically fairer again. The island fenris as well as the area in the silver forest would also have to become bluish. I don’t think that the Wildhammer would give up Area Peak, I still don’t believe that, and because Arathi is now right next to it…it would make even less sense to give it up, because there is now a wide front of alliance support lines from Arathi over Hinterland to Gilneas.
And Val’Sharrah for example, is no alliance-Territory, its part of the cc and aszuna is still neutral too. So…its only horde and neutral and not horde/alliance/neutral land
Uh, yeah, that’s why I brought up the points.
i mean, why should the alliance accept the ashenvale part if the alliance don´t get a single…land , but only lost now. I mean in this scenario, the horde gained and the alliance lost only.
(The westcoust of Kalimdor, the areas in Hinterland and parts of north Ek)
Because the alliance already had more land even pre bfa. That map shows how equality looks like. And i think that way it is the best for both factions involved. Both have the same amount of zones.
Wut? The Alliance fully controls ALL of the NE zones (the Horde completely vacates Northern Kalimdor), while the EK Alliance fully picks up every single zone south of the Hinterlands. Without any contest between the two factions. And sure, the NEs can keep some territory on the Eastern coast of Feralas, but they have like no real holdings left in Stonetalon (and none in Desolace). And reinforcing either of those locations would require that Goblin ravine to remain open. And as for the rest of the territories, its just the Horde largely securing previously neutral territories that hold Tauren, Troll, and Goblin settlements (and those groups brought in too).
And at the cost of Aerie Peak (trading for rebuilding and finish purifying Grim Batol, the Highlands AND the Wetlands for the Wildhammer, their ancestral lands) … the Dragonmaw leave completely from the Highlands. The Forsaken abandon any holdings in Hillsbrad, Gilneas, and Southern SP. While the EK Horde (4 Races if the Forest Trolls can be brought in) replace them with the Plaguelands. They Alliance also officially takes Deadwind Pass and the Swamp of Sorrows (the latter of which isn’t unsalvageable territory, and has Broken settlements).
The Alliance loses ONE real location, in Aerie Peak (which is a severe contention point for many reasons, and a super weird location for just as many). While the Horde picks up a bunch of previously neutral locations. Creating what you see in this map, a roughly 1/3rd-2/3rds split for both continents. With a generally 50/50 split between terrain, including offshore territories. Where EVERYONE is out of eachothers ways, have plenty of room to rebuild, grow, and prosper, and use very clear geographic boundaries to enforce and define their borders. I don’t think I’ve seen a map be more even and fair here (again, outside of Aerie Peak, which is a single generation old in Dwarven terms and IS a living example of colonialism on Trolls. Have the Wildhammer reclaim Grim Batol with the aid of the Void Elves, Magni, Dark Irons and Wrathion. All those fools owe Anduin a solid).
As you surely noticed, it was about the narrow strip near Eschental, even yesterday, up to the river and on the map it is also marked as a horde area. There is a for and against argument, until today without clear agreement.
Also the area Stonetalon is not finally clarified with it.
and the west coast strip and oh well…neutral areas are actually hard to classify, as I said, I don’t think the dwarves will give up Area Peak (Grim batol is still cursed and won’t recover so fast), nor do I think that organizations like the Argent Crusade will suddenly just accept that all their areas will now become horde areas in EK
and also areas like Desolace are still areas where the CC operates to make this land alive again and Moon Wells always play a crucial role there, and these only bring the Night Elves with them.
Not if Magni is to be believed at the end of BfA. Where he outright said the corruption of the Old Gods is on the way out. Which should also apply to Grim Batol. Not only that, but the Alliance has access to resources and experts on that particular topic that could more than make up the difference. Magni, Wrathion, The Void Elves, the Lightforged, and even the ones who placed that curse … the Dark Irons. Truly, the Wildhammers ancestral capital and lands have never been in a better position to be rebuilt and reclaimed than now. And they can leave the Forest Trolls with their ONE last bastion of ancestral land (until the Horde gifts them the prior Scarlet Enclave lands to reunite their Northern and Southern holdings). Also, the CC are officially a Neutral organization. If they want to stay in Desolace and help heal the land in that neutral capacity? Fine. Its just politically Horde.
As for the river issue. Pretty sure OP meant to place that Border on the Southfury (and it appears to be on the Southfury based on the Durotar part). Its the map is weird and places those two rivers weirdly close together.+
NEUTRAL Faction doesn’t mean…that they do everything and bow down to the big player factions, you kick them out, they’re gone, they’re out and they’re not coming back either. I mean, the earthen ring would neither leafe…places who they are in charge to …bow toward the alliance, why do you expect this?
And in the end, restoration desolace is directly dependent on the night elves, it is a deeply dead land, thanks to the legion, which was only possible to create enclaves of life thanks to the huge moon well there and waters from the wells of eternity under northrassil.
I don’t see any way but to draw on the resources and Knowledge of the night elves if Desolace is ever to become the jungle it once was.
Neutral Factions also don’t get to mean “wink, wink, they’re actually Alliance and get to hold lands and territories for the Alliance’s convenience” either. Which you seem to truly operate off of (because those “Neutral” Organizations are always expected to make land grabs and operate in ways that are convenient for the Blue Team, while are protected by a blanket of “Neutrality”). And, I think the Tauren and Troll Druidic groups can work to finish healing Desolace on their own if needed, thanks.
