That’s a bit much guys
Relax with that
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but buuut they have shorter range…
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On one hand, Hover is definitely one of the best mobility abilities in the game. If not the best.
On the other hand, people who’ve never really played Evoker do not understand how serious of a limitation it is to be a shorter range than everything.
You are never outranging spam CC.
You’re easier to land psychic screams on.
You’re easier to blind.
You’re easier to drop totems on.
You’re basically permanently in charge and leap ranges.
You’re always in DG range.
On top of always being close enough to be CC’d by everyone from every angle, several of your heals require that you actively be in melee range. Dreamflight, Verdant Embrace, Rescue. These are powerful tools for escape as well, I’ll grant you, but it’s relevant to the conversation.
And, of course, we cannot cast a hard CC on someone without being close enough for them to have begun casting theirs first.
I’m not saying it’s fine as is, I’m just saying that ending any aspect of Evoker balance with, “But lol range is shorter” is ignoring the massive downside that really is.
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Nullifying Shroud.
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Dev is the least likely ranged to be targeted, except for BM. Dev also has the highest dps and burst dps of all ranged classes. I wonder if hover and shroud make up for the lack of range argument….
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the culprit isn’t hoover or shroud imo. It’s the pvp talent unburdened flight. You should be able to slow them, but you can’t because they have so many charges of hoover currently.
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evoker beyond reforged range, does not have any powerful passive defense, we need to activate our damage reductions or heals.
Nullifying Shroud has a 1.5m cooldown and 3 dispelable charges, definitely a good ability against some classes, but not very useful against others.
Despite having excellent burst damage, evokers have terrible continuous DPS, due to mastery. The chance of killing someone outside of Dragon Rage is very low.
Many complain about the evoker’s mobility, but apart from that, what do we have?
You’re actually proving my point here.
Can you even imagine giving Nullifying Shroud to a Disc priest?
Nope. Evokers need one of the most broken defenses in the entire game just to be able to engage at the start of matches reliably.
Evokers are the weakest healer in solo shuffle, tied with Mistweavers (Very close). Acting as if their mobility makes them broken is not matched with statistics. They’re admittedly better in BGB due to pure throughput and strong movement.
As for Unburdened Flight, it’s quite strong, but hardly a universal pick. Lots of high rated Evokers don’t even take this talent. Hard to justify nerfs on a class that’s just not performing super well.
All classes have limitations my man. The numbers are what they are. Clearly devs are less limited than other classes.
The only place Evokers are not very far below average in representation is in the very, very highest brackets of BGB. Someone more knowledgeable about that would have to explain why. Maybe you their move abilities make them very strong FCs? That’d be my guess.
They’re poor in arena and poor at lower ratings.
But nerfing a class because 10 evokers are really good and the rest are doing poor seems like a weird step.
just like evokers. I’m not saying they are better or worse than others, I’m saying that just like all other classes they have their ups and downs.
Yes, evokers are excellent FCs and are also good for killing enemy FCs.
If you can move while casting for most of the fight while also having a bunch of instant cast abilities to supplement that, then you aren’t even a ranged class at that point, you’re a melee with 25 yd range.
Blink breaks stuns and has an 11 second cooldown. Hover is not blink.
It’s also not freedom because unlike freedom, you can still be rooted.
Hover also doesn’t make you immune to interrupts like Spiritwalker’s Grace.
It’s kinda that, but also they have to channel most of their damage output
But yeah resetting hover on deep breath + the CDR dev has for deep breath now does make their mobility a little excessive. And if you touch em, they have the highest armor in the game.
I wish PvP talents had choice nodes so you could pick between interrupt immunity on wall vs snare immunity on hover or something like that.
Spammable CC, AoE purge, friendly and hostile grip, time stop, chrono loop, time spiral, oppressing roar.
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Okay, let’s assume you’re right.
How many other healers that thrive in melee are doing great?
None?
Agreed.
As for Devastation, eh. I don’t know. Their numbers are also pretty rough. I think this may be a case of something being really annoying to play against, but not altogether that strong.
I feel like the sentence, “Wow, Evokers are really hard to kill” is said a LOT over the corpse of an evoker, lol.
That has nothing to do with the Evoker range and everything to do with tuning. Pres was by far the best healer in the first half of DF despite their range
Are you trying to establish that class tuning and class mechanics aren’t related to each other and that they operate without interaction?
That’s a bold, bold claim.
The shorter range is an element of the class that everything is built around. You can’t analyze the class without keeping it in mind.
I’m not calling for anything to be nerfed. I think devs are fine. I think most classes are fine. There are outliers that could use some nerfs like frost mage, fury and WW but thats always going to be the case. Even the biggest offenders aren’t THAT bad right now.
You asked which healers thriving in melee are doing great, as if it’s OK to have a broken kit just just because melee healers aren’t doing great. I’d also argue Pres is doing pretty good rn, they are very under rated in BGB. They are easily the best FC class now by far (thanks in part to how broken Hover is)
Not that I’m really arguing you’re wrong, but wasn’t pres pretty mid to start? It was hard to go off stats because it was a very new and different spec + people didn’t want to be a dragon so I would assume rep was low. But I also remember Cdew investing a ton of time in pres because of how it was in the alpha but iirc it was pretty bad by the time S1 AWC rolled around.
I think my primary point is just that people have a tendency to look at single parts of a spec and say, “That’s OP”.
Specs aren’t balanced that way, or at least shouldn’t be.
Having a broken kit is a problem, I agree.
But what people are saying is that the mobility is too good and that it should be nerfed, without even slightly acknowledging the reality of having a shorter range. This causes an immediate problem with the discussion, as the mobility is balanced around range. I’m not saying it’s not strong, I’m saying if it was any weaker how much worse would Evokers be?
I’d argue that even a mild nerf to Evoker mobility right now would completely eliminate their viability in all PvP game modes.