Heck, I know a handful of players who DID quit the game instantly, because of re-demonising the Horde & being lied to about a ‘morally grey’ faction war.
Straight up, Blizzard were just lying $&%#! narcs.
They don’t care about the Horde, they claim otherwise but we all know it’s a facade. It’s just straight up BS.
World of Warcraft (not the WC games that came before, for obvious reasons) game’s history with faction-conflict over the pass few expansions is history enough of Blizzard not caring about the Horde.
If you are Horde:
You’re fodder.
Trash scum to be put down, and have the ‘glorious’ boot of the Alliance stomp down on your throat and told to behave. You’re a tool to elevate your opposing faction, nothing more.
If you are Alliance:
You’re the heroes!
Hell, even with the Lich King – Lorewise they depicted it as only the Alliance taking down Arthas, after they took dibs to pursuing him after Deathbringer. Which is kind of a kick in the face to the Forsaken race alone, not to mention the Blood Elves.
As someone else once said:
“I canceled my sub Til Last Titan. I know Midnight will be bad since even in Blood elves land they will make the alliance elves the Protagonist somehow.”
— And towards that, as much as I’d like to say:
"That’s silly! "
"Don’t be preposterous! "
"They won’t do that! "
“They wouldn’t dare do that. Foolish thought.”
Deep down …
I know they’re right.
I saw all the same arguments as above made against those pre-BFA who guessed Blizz were lying & Horde would be the villains (again) — They were ridiculed & spoken to like children … And they ended up being right. lol
Not just to the Alliance, but in general:
Anyone else sick of the Horde getting shafted, or having their themes screwed over? If so, what’s your biggest ‘irk’ with the story of the Horde? Either as a whole, or towards the story to one of their races?
My present cope is that the spotlight will shift to one of the blood elf characters after TWW, but who am I kidding, it’s going to be Alleria all the way down baby. Losing their capital and kingdom to neutrality won’t be to the blood elves’ benefit either, if that’s the barrel we’re staring down with this “elf unification” tagline.
When Saurfang died there were two npcs in orgrimmar that said something to the affect of
“Bob, I’m tired of seeing my heroes die.”
“Well Earl, you can’t be a hero unless you die.”
Overwatch’s Mercy best encapsulates the Alliance’s response to this metric: Heroes NEVER die!!
As I mentioned in the “Why do you hate BFA?” thread, the cinematic “The Negotiation” was the final straw that killed the Horde as a faction for me. Specifically, these lines: "That was the great lie upon which the Horde was founded—that anything we did was honorable… We could not fill the chasm between the Horde and Alliance if we labored for a thousand years.”
I swear, if they have another “Horde are the bad guys + aggressors” along with “Alliance are the good guys + defenders” — I’m dead set going to classic, or just finding a different game … It’s ridiculous at this point.
The Horde always were the bad guys. How many genocides, mass murders, Warchiefs going over to the darkside will it take to understand that.
There are some things that are irredeemable.
Murdering hundreds of thousands of Draenei on draenor. That was the Orcs.
Murdering hundreds of thousands Humans during the 1st and 2nd wars. Orcs and trolls again.
Torturing Alexstrasza and forcing her to send her children to their death…HORDE with Deathwings help.
The use of an Arcane Bomb to murder the citizens of Theramore and the actual murder of Ronin, Head of the Kirin Tor. Garrosh Orc Warchief
The attempted murder of Anduin by Garrosh. Orc Warchief during Pandaria.
Garrosh going back in time to create the Iron Horde. Garrosh, who then murdered the bronze dragon that helped him. An Orc, again
Genocide of Night Elves in Ashenvale, Darkshore and the burning of Teldrasil. Sylvanas, Undead Warchief. With the main force being Orcs, trolls, undead and Blood Elves.
The only Theme the Horde deserves is the same one late 1930s and early 1940s Germany had.
Theres a reason the other side is called the Alliance.
And I thought night elf rants were over. What we deserve is not for you to decide. First post got it right. They will force Alleria and neutrality on us and it will be ugly.
The best thing about the Horde was the blood elves since all other races don’t have good lore anymore and got twisted so hard they aren’t capable of spotlight in their current version anymore. With the sindorei gone too Blizzard will deal the final blow and yeet us out of the narrative for good.
The Horde always were the bad guys. How many genocides, mass murders, Warchiefs going over to the darkside will it take to understand that.
It’s almost like Warcraft III set up the playable Horde as a faction wanting to escape conflict. And it’s almost like Warcraft III should be actually honored and respected, with WC 1-2 frankly left in the trash.
The only Theme the Horde deserves is the same one late 1930s and early 1940s Germany had.
This is a common theme among nelves. I was on a discord once and they actually blame all Horde players for their current miserys. This discussion is a dead end.
I wouldn’t even be mad about being evil full time but Blizzard refuses to stay coherent on the story so they better stick with ONE theme of the whole picture instead of making it dependent on the leaders.
My hope is that Midnight will very much show the Blood Elves confidently and competently triumphing over the forces trying to destroy their homeland, strengthened by their past battles and aided by their allies in the Horde.
Even as someone that loathes Void Elves in every regard, they’re going to be involved in the story of Midnight. What I do not want to see happen is the Blood Elves very sensible choice to exile Void Elves be thrown back in their face when the Void Elves’ aid is suddenly indispensable in a battle against the void.
But exactly that will happen for sure. Horde elves aren’t allowed to be right ever. Even in TBC we had to be saved by Velen from our own gone bad leader. That is a basic trope in the Horde by now. And I know Umbric and Alleria will rub it in extra hard when meeting Bob again.
Yeah, that’d be refreshing for a change.
– Though I’m kind of doubtful of Blizzard’s writing – especially when it comes to Horde races & their kingdoms.
Percent.
… If they end up pulling some BS like:
“See you need the Void Elves!! Be humble and accept that we’re the best for the Quel’Thalas. Not Blood Elves, but the High Elves and the Void Elves!”
— I will deadset be wanting to throw a brick through Blizz-HQ’s window.
Although sadly, I fear that’s the way it’s going to turn out.
WCIII had some friction on that score. Thrall wanted the Horde to escape conflict and exist peacefully. His own men, however, grew restless and the moment they saw Alliance were happier than pigs in sh*t at the chance to fight them again. Moments like those were later addressed, such as with Grom being saved with the aid of Jaina, and then the two forces working together. It demonstrated that the Orcs, the Horde, were able to grow past these urges to seek worthy opponents, and it also demonstrated that the humans, the Alliance, were able to grow past their prejudices and hatred.
WoW itself, however, started with a lot of problems as far as the Horde went. The biggest issue, was the Forsaken. The Forsaken joining the Horde was very clearly Blizzard wanting a playable Scourge faction, but one not fitting into either of the two main factions. Rather than making a third faction, they slapped the Forsaken onto the Horde. The justifications for this were very weak. The Tauren for some reason thought the Forsaken could be helped, but we never saw an attempt made. Meanwhile Grom’s body wasn’t likely even cold yet when Thrall accepted a Dreadlord into the Horde, in a position of authority.
The same issue exists with the Night Elves and the Alliance. While the Night Elves could’ve been their own faction, Blizzard slapped them onto the Alliance and then pulled their fangs and claws and turned them into purple High Elves. The Night Elves on WC3 never quite made it into WoW, sadly. Meanwhile, the Horde was saddled with a, ‘race,’ that forced them to ignore many of their key gripes with the Alliance (the internment camps for example), and kept dragging the Horde down with morally vanta black antics.
That’s not the story told by one of the developers who was there at the time:
Honestly, I think the biggest “problem” with the Forsaken is that the devs took the opportunity to throw in a lot of what they saw as dark humor, that players ended up taking seriously.
I really wish the Alliance and Horde had not been the playable factions. Not that I have some solution that would have worked in 2004. You could have had faction wars that actually had proper endings and such too. But most importantly you wouldn’t need to come up with an explanation for blood elves, draenei,forsaken, night elves,etc to join a faction even if it was weak or didn’t make much sense. Not saying I have all the details worked out just that it would be cool on paper at least.
That’s… literally, EXACTLY the story told by that dev, what are you talking about?
So, they wanted a playable Scourge faction, it didn’t fit on either because it would be evil (evil races but as heroes being the WCIII Horde, Forsaken being listed as an exception), and they added the Forsaken to the Horde.
"
"
"
Foolish thought.”
