Horde, you can’t have both

The Dark Iron Dwarf Racial is still good, it increased primary stat by 600 and removes all debuffs, increasing primary stat by 200 for each removed, with no cap. On a two minute cooldown as well. I don’t know what you mean by, “complained into the ground.” Still a very good racial.

To add onto that though, one good racial doesn’t mean everyone will switch to it. Not every class can switch to it either. Matter of the fact is, Alliance don’t want to participate in War Mode because they feel as if Horde overwhelmingly outnumbers them.

Why do we outnumber them? Because most of the high end players, such as mythic raiders or the high end arena junkies, switch to Horde for the small advantage they can get.

They have tried to incentivize Alliance to join War Mode by increasing the rewards they obtain from it. As I said, it was a temporary fix, bound to fail. The best solution is to make it worth people’s time to play Alliance.

One race with a good racial, Dark Iron Dwarf, isn’t going to fix anything. I’ll reiterate, buff the existing races’ racial ability.

Gnome racial could be buffed by not only removing all snares/roots, but also making them immune to snares/roots for 4 seconds after. Maybe even a small boost?

Dwarf racial could be matched to similar effects of Dark Iron Dwarf, it already removes debuffs and decreases damage taken by 10%, maybe spice it up by adding, “for each harmful debuff removed, decrease damage taken by an additional 2%”

Human racial could share a cooldown with trinket by 1.5 minutes instead of 3 minutes.

Draenei passive racial should once again be AOE, increasing Strength, Agility, and Intellect (scales with level) to all group members.

This wasn’t originally in the list but hey, buff Worgen racial. It’s just a useless speed buff, let’s change it to maybe, “Increases movement speed by 60% and critical strike by 10% for 8 seconds.”

Just a few things that would make things more interesting.

Have you ever play oce ? Xfer to frostmourne

Oceanic and RP shard are alliance dominate. It makes no sense to me as to why they get the buff and reap the rewards while also being dominate. How is that fair to us, RP and oceanic horde players? We have it just as bad as alliance does on US normal shards. We were outnumbered 2:1 before the buff, now it’s like 5:1 on my shard. Where is our buff for being against overwhelming odds?

there. i fixed it for you to make your argument a bit better.

Like Horde are in Oceania?

yeah, i guess so. i don’t play there so i have no clue… kind of like it seems your arguments are based on your OCE experiences and arguing with us who do not.

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they hotfixed sharding in december 6 2018 to move from “fill the shard with 200 players unbiased of faction pop” to “fill each shard 3:1 for alliance until there are no alliance left” which left Kultiras/Zand from being horde dominated (since there are more horde players with WM on) to over night alliance are everywhere but yet they have 20-30% WM buff.

they did this on purpose as the plainly stated they want horde to turn off wm (to balance out the factions with it on).

but they have now deployed a similar “fix” to battle for Nazjatar event

this was really all stated in the hotfix or explained somewhere else?

sound more like an assumption…

There was a hot fix. I believe it changed the algorithm from just filling the shards with whoever came into the zone first, regardless of balance, to filling the shards to a 1:1 faction ratio. To Horde used to having a 10-1 or 100-1 advantage, whatever it was in 8.0, this might have seemed like it was 3:1 Alliance.

I do have to agree that hot fix fixed nothing. The factions were balanced in 8.1.5 by the AOO quest. And he is correct that the purpose of AOO was to get horde “who didn’t even like to PVP” to turn off war mode.

yeah, that’s one of the biggest reasons we’re getting overrun by more and more horde- it’s just like the start of BfA; the more alliance turn wm off, the more horde turn it on. they didn’t fix anything… only made it worse.

That’s their claim, but face it: they HAD to. When there was just one list, the first sixty guilds were horde and after that, you only saw a dozen Alliance guilds. It flat out demonstrated how bad the imbalance is.

I’ve been a fan of WM for a while now. As a raider, the bonus to AP, Rep, etc has been a boon to progression.

That said, it’s basically spelling the end of world pvp forever unless Blizzard either removes it or starts handing out tangible buffs to Alliance (i.e 20% more Damage in PvP, as an example obviously number adjusting would need to take place). Why? The “incentive” is no longer worth the effort. And next expansion WM / open world pvp will be non-existent.

Even at max, 30% bonus (we’ve been hovering at 25% for two+ weeks now), Alliance is still out numbered severely in pvp. That bonus is not nearly enough to entice people to turn on WM. It’s just not. And by the time we get another expansion, you will have left such a bad taste in Alliance pvpers and general players mouths that they will literally never turn on WM no matter how good you make it. Some areas you just can’t set foot in cause even though there might be six or seven Alliance, just around the corner is a enough Horde to fill a raid group (or two).

And next exanpsion when no Alliance bother with world pvp, the Horde are going to ramp up the complaining past 11. Even though they are their own worst enemy, they want people to fight yet they have no problems letting 30 of their guys literally chase down 1 poor guy who tries to goblin glider away to safety. Yea thats “pvp” right there, thats what Horde wants.

Honestly I’m just at my boiling point for the expansion when it comes to this. I need all the AP, resources and gold I can get as a raider, but when I can’t zone into Nazjatar without the Alliance starting hub being camped by more enemy name plates than you can count on one screen… Its just not worth it. I’d rather spam heroic islands for 12 hours a day to grind my AP.

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To be honest, that what scares me: less people playing. WPvP is being disintegrated by Thanos’ power. I’m running out of Alliance to punish. Classic launch isn’t going to be helping that, either. No matter how much the Alliance gets rewarded, it’s not enough to save it. The Horde keeps coming on strong with their non-AOO, paltry 10% currency bonused hides.

It’s simple really…warmode is a broken system, that just introduced more problems to world pvp:

  • warmode splits the playerbase, making half the players invisible to the other half, even on the same server. Makes the game feel empty - the exact opposite of blizzard’s stated design goal.
  • sharding doesn’t resolve this issue - it does however destroy any sense of community/pattern to interactions by randomly moving players around. It also randomly pulls players out in the middle of something, like killing a rare they’ve camped for 60 minutes, which sucks and ruins the game for them.
  • the sharding system is either being rampantly abused, or is very badly programmed, as every world pvp event is incredibly 1-sided - usually 200+ active involved pvp players for 1 faction, and maybe 10-20 for the other. Even if before the event begins it was balanced, it imbalances the moment the event begins. Either the goal is to force 1 team to have an insurmountable advantage and thus alternate wins, or the system is just broken. Either way, it sucks.
  • warmode gives pve rewards for pvp content. This has always been and always will be a problem - it pushes players that don’t want to pvp to feel they need to do it to keep up in pve content. Eg. extra bonus 200 rep just added for Mekka, not obtainable any other way.
  • solution remains simple. Get rid of warmode, go back to the less broken pvp/pve server system. Remove bonus rewards for pvp’ing.
  • merge a bunch of servers. Not a few - a bunch. The player base has eroded, and there’s no identity left to servers anyway.
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Your first sentence sums up 1 problem with warmode quite well:
I’ve been a fan of WM for a while now. As a raider, the bonus to AP, Rep, etc has been a boon to progression.

Nobody should be needing to pvp to get an edge on pve content. The pve rewards for pvp’ing force people who don’t want to do it to join in.

The other part - Bliz appears to have tilted the shard-phasing to port in huge numbers of 1 faction into each of the world events. Not sure if the goal is to make them alternate wins, or if its being abused somehow, or if its just badly designed… but it’s been like 10 to 1 odds every time i’v done the event. If the #'s are even when the event starts, the game immediately ports in a huge number of players for one faction to imbalance it.

In SW I see everybody: those who have it on and those who don’t. I guess that’s why I like going to SW with WM on these days.

I liked it when I can engage WM people at will in the cities, but there’s not many of those going around anymore, even for the A-side that gets rewarded up the wazoo. It’s posing an existential crisis for me.

This would really be good.

I was convinced that if you could run high mythics or raids, you could sneeze at the WM rewards. But I suspect that this a problem for the literal plebeians(as opposed to the posh patricians who have powerful endgame connections).

The aggregate numbers are disproportionate. What ever happened to Merc Mode? That could be used to balance things out; overfills becomes mercs for the other faction. Or Blizzard could just put in flagged bots as well.

It was my understanding that there was already a split between PvE and PvP servers.

apart of the problem (is it really a problem in a general sense though?) is that prior to 8.2 the horde were not incentized to WPvP as much as they alliance due to the AOO and general ilvl degradation over a patch.

the alliance probably noticed prior to 8.2 “theres less Horde around, and we are winning more WPvP engagements” well right now 8.2 is fresh Ilvls are still low and essences require PvP for both factions. What this has done is mobilized the already heavier populated faction to go out there and “get phat lewtz” by doing all the PvP possible and conquest/honor farming. this will eventually slow down as ilvl degradation kicks in again but until than it will likely remain an alliance slaughterfest.

not only that massive amounts of horde are flying to every WQ that gives 200+ azerite as a reward making the world artificially overpopulated with horde. At any given time there are 15+ Call to Arms groups for both quests going, that wasnt the case pre 8.2 because no one needed the conquest, no one needed the honor, no one needed the azerite (in a general sense) and the rewards were paltry relative to what was available through other means, but right now? at the beginning of a new patch… people are doing it all.

Well if i look on all my toon, since the new zone appeared, i have manage to loot 2 air drop only and won 2 PvP event. That on 4 toon that are all ilvl 410+.

The inbalance in number is just insane as the horde is litterally a horde. So what will result in this? some of the essence that required some PvP unlock wont be available to many alliance PvPers. Since one require you to loot 5 airdrop. That dont seems much, but for alot of alliance players that kinda like asking to swim across the Atlantic and back. We might get it… when all horde player wont need the airdrop anymore.

Problem is simple, population imbalance. Shard hopping during PvP event. As soon as you got a populatiojn imbalance you start a dead spiral, people being stump will soon leave the PvP aspect and just turn off WM which increase the imbalance and put even more stress on those remaining and make the faction with superior number to get extermely agressive especially during event or CTA, or just to be able to fight. Im sorry as fun as some ganking can be, it dont take long for the PvP to get really boring without an opponent that can really fight back to be challenging. So that simply push the population being outnumbred to leave, and to have the dominant faction to have their number increase (no one love to lose) via transfert or simply because the PvE farmer go there as well since the bonus for being flag WM is interesting and their is virtually no risk what so ever!

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