Holy pally isn't fun

Classes Paladin
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It changed quite a bit actually, at least in terms of what made legion gameplay good. No it didn’t receive groundbreaking changes but a lot of what was fun in legion was almost all gutted or changed.

In the previous expansions before legion especially MoP/WoD we had many tools for dealing with “downtime” or filling. The playstyle in BfA isn’t even remotely close to what WoD or MoP had. Then you take a look at legion and you’ll see a lot of the main things that made Hpal fun were removed and yes it’s the same for most classes which is why class design is a hot topic currently and mainly negative.

I won’t talk about aura of sac itself since it was blatantly OP but we can run through the basics:

-Ilterendi giving you a small rotation inside of the buff window to manage.

-Maraads (in ToS) adding Lotm into the playstyle which also added a pseudo-rotation and also introduced some min/maxing you could do with AoS that made it even more insane. Was also great for beacon healing.

-Power Of the Silver Hand. Nothing crazy but in dungeons when this procced you essentially had an extra LoH. This was really nice in higher keys in m+ where you’d watch for this often.

-Holy Shock crit. Changed from always doubling your crit to a flat 25% (and now 30%) base crit chance. I admit I’m not sure this was a good thing for the spec but it definitely sped it up and was undeniably fun imo.

-Tyr’s deliverance. Was really nice for 5 mans. Essentially a small aoe heal that also buffed your healing on all targets hit. In raids it wasn’t bad either and after the buffs it received through traits it felt nice to use.

-Nighthold set bonus gave us 2 charges to IoL. This was really fun imo as it allowed you to pool 1 extra charge for a good moment if it was going to get use before HS was off cd.

-Divine purpose. This was a talent that sat in a row with HA and Prism. Prism wasn’t viable at all in legion and still isn’t in BfA however DP spiced things up by adding an extra proc into our playstyle. This is no longer an optimal due to being on the beacon row which relegates it to a “niche” talent in most cases.

-Highlords ring. This legendary allowed you to take 2 talents on the same row. Many took DP/HA which added an extra proc to the rotation -and- an extra CD.

These are just some things that were removed and ultimately for me made the spec feel like a gutted version of legions design which is basically what it really is. I’m not sure too many people would enjoy the fact the spec they liked last expansion was gutted and then hardly changed afterward so it’s a shell of what it was.

I’m not saying we need buffs. I think our performance is good. I think our gameplay is just really stale especially after losing artifacts/tier/legendaries. Not saying the sky is falling either, just that it’s clear that the spec didn’t get enough treatment throughout beta and was left with a lot of removed interactivity and flavor while not much else was added outside of AC.

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62

Yeah I made a druid. To me it’s been 100% more fun and the healing is yuge.

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63

Hpal is a downer for me too. It really used to be a fun spec.
Need to have an option to opt out of the ranged mastery thing, it was a lame idea to have forced.
Big heals need absorb shield added back.
Word of glory, or some mini-hot needs added.

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64

I always thought holy pal mastery should do splash healing on your single target spells.

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65

That actually sounds really cool. Essentialy like an automatic floating beacon.

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66

Issue with this is that you’d get punished harder for fights that require spreading. It seems like a nice idea but as far as i can imagine it, it doesn’t actually interact with the player (holy and disc priests are guilty of this type of mastery), which imo makes it boring. Currently paladins, monks, druids and shaman have ways to interact/maximize and control how they use their mastery, it’s essentially another mechanic to manage. If they do rework the mastery, they need to maintain some form of interactivity (which is why im not a fan of bubbles on big heals either). Maybe if casts left a lingering buff that procced a heal similar to the way the glimmer of light worked just with all abilities, but then we’d have to lose single target output because the focus would be more on AOE which would be an fortunate change. So as much as everyone kicks and screams about hpal mastery I think it actually suits the spec very well and is much healthier for balancing the spec numbers wise.

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Homogenizing all the classes is a recipe for a boring game. Why can’t healers have niche roles and shine on certain fights and be semi lackluster on others?

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68

That’s what weighting more of our single target power into AOE would do though. 4/6 healing specs are strong with AOE, monks and paladins fit the spot healing niche best which is their identity. Being a melee healer is paladins current identity, and paladins do best on stacking fights where the mastery is maximized but can still do okay with spread fights because you get the benefit of melee at least being close.

In contrast, a splash AOE with a radius of anything less than 12 yards would result in mastery being legitimately useless on most spread fights where 10 yards is the minimum spread distance. And to balance it, you’d have to take healing out of single target heals which is a hpals niche and redistribute them into AOE spash healing putting them closer to the 4 classes that excel in AOE healing. I’d argue that this homogenizes holy paladins more than their current mastery.

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You’re right. Where I would really bad, is like ghuun. Lots of spreading in phase 3. I agree that healers all should have a niche. I admit I overlooked some of the hpal abilities that give it it’s own shine, but as a newly unretired healer, I can’t have fun with hpal. I’m just used to priest healing I suppose, as that is what I mained most of my early Wow life. Now I’m trying out druid, and so far they seem fun, getting to run around spreading hots and channeling tranquility when things get rough. Its also fun being able to hop into cat form and match the tank in dps, making fights go by super smooth.

1 Like
70

I think the problem is more likely you and the people you brought with you before probably just aren’t very good holy paladins. Try working on it more.

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No, were fine in raids.

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I never said they were bad, just that they might be more sought for in smaller groups.

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What I’ve noticed in BfA is that when I’m not raiding in my guild it seems like 90% of paladins in PuG’s are speced incorrectly and/or have un-optimized stats on their gear.

I almost always whisper these paladins and try to provide insight but most just don’t respond. I’m wondering how much of these players are a part of the “HPally sucks” club…?

IMO holy paladin is really strong and only going to get a lot stronger as higher secondary stats come into play. Especially crit.

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Holy Paladin imo is alright, we have some good cd’s and if you use certain talents you can beast out some strong heals. Do I think they are the best, not really. But I have fun and I feel tanky with the plate.

I do hate Light of the Martyr however. I don’t see a purpose for it. If I need an oh sh*t heal I’ll use it, but maybe once or twice in a boss fight (if that).

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75

Healing with a holy paladin is boring and simple.

In a raid setting a holy paladin is barely middle of the pack in Uldir in 8.1 and was scraping the bottom of the barrel with shamans pre 8.1. There were virtual no number changes besides some azerite armor talent changes for holy paladins. Mistweavers have banged up to the number one spot in 8.1 and they can do a better job of both tank and raid healing then a holy paladin can.

Healing as a holy paladin is boring, in a raid setting, and dead simple. There is very little interaction between our various spells, unlike most other classes.

A holy paladin doesn’t have any sort of hot, damage shield or spammable AOE heal, incredible weaknesses when other classes can bring that.

A holy paladin can bring 20% damage reduction on a 3 minute timer, and 2 point some percent if people stand within 10 yards of the paladins.

Our only spammable heals are single target ones, we have beacons, yes, but taking Beacon of Virtue in a raid setting isn’t the best idea. Beacon of Faith is the safe choice, and reliable. Having Divine Purpose on the “beacon row” doesn’t make the choice interesting nor fun. I want Divine Purpose, but just switching it from it’s previous row to its new row made healing as a holy paladin more boring. It doesn’t force anyone to pick that talent because it isn’t competitive on the row.

At least it’s not Fervent Martyr. But it took all of last expansion for the devs to get rid of that trap of a useless talent.

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76

Just bring back the old aura of sacrifice or the maraad’s legendary. Personally maraad’s was the most fun I had. Paired with the T20 but even without it.

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77

As a holy pally

We’re ok.

My main issues are that:

  1. Our mastery is garbage.
  2. One of our cooldowns can be difficult because for AC we have to do damage to the boss. So in situations like Vectis where we have to run out during contagion so we don’t aoe everyone with more than 6 stacks we have to catch up using our AC.
  3. Groups with more range means we’re standing in range to get the most out of our aura and mastery… then we have to run in to damage during AC.
  4. if there is monk or holy priest we’re basically trash…
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78

As a “melee” healer it’s frustrating being in dungeon groups that have mobs who interrupt/silence/stun in melee range. Makes me a sad pally

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79

You’ve very accurately captured how I feel about things - Holy Paladin and how poorly it feels is the primary reason I’ve unsubbed out of anger/unhappiness.

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80

I’m a returning player who used to heal main/off tank as a HPally.

I’m scrolling through this thread seeing lots of arguments and opinions about what HPally should be, rotations, mobility, words like “Saviour” & “Cleave heal”. Worst of all, we are compared using HPS.

Since when has healing been about numbers? Isn’t a tank’s job to keep aggro off your team, dps drops the boss as soon as possible while the healer keeps everyone alive?

It seems a lot of people are just unhappy that the Paladin class cannot perform roles of other healing classes. Has the content become so mundane that raid/mythic progression is not enough, and we have to compare who contributed the most?

I don’t understand these talks about snipe heals. If the raid isn’t taking damage and the raid healer decided to throw in some heals for the tank, this isn’t snipe heal, this is the raid is doing a good job.

Vice versa, depending on how you use beacon, if your raid is in trouble and the tanks are holding up, does Hshock or LoD raid consider snipe heals?
Just keep everyone alive and focus on your main allocated designated heals.

I always feel HPally excels when overhealing, just spam those Holy lights that are virtually free to cast. So it’s a lot about positioning. When you are forced to move, throw in some LoM/Shock/LoD while on the go, then continue to Holy light/FoL.

Each class should have it’s own unique style of healing/dps/tank. It’s because of complains like this, based on numbers, every class is converging into the same play style. Why not ask blizzard for some channeling AOE heal with low mana cost and spammable? I’m sure the HPS will improve, so will the size of your e-peen.

TL;DR: Healers job is to keep people alive. Stop comparing numbers

4 Likes