Nobody is asking for havoc to return to df, that was a war crime, we are asking for small buffs, but continue making unhinged paragraphs lmfao.
Imagine if you read any of the reasonable level headed asks before you wrote all that mess?
Considering you aren’t even playing retail, let me help you out, it is dead last in sustained st in pve, it has bad sustained st period, and it needs single target sustained buffs outside of it’s burst windows.
I can think it has relatively a bad wall and not think it needs massive defensive upgrades, any post I have ever made about it I have asked for damage buffs outside meta.
Definitely a last effort to get you to read though, I am not your kindergarten teacher lmfao
This whole time you’ve brought up damage like once prior, so I’ve debunked you’re whole defensive argument, now it’s time to listen about damage buffs from the duelist with 1.6k rounds in solos but wants to come after others with literally 16 matches total in the season, then expects a civil discourse while trying to point the finger at the other party for starting the collapse of any amount of civility.
Every person who has wasted time trying to find common ground with you on anything you’ve just tried to discount what they’re saying by calling them trolls or and acting like they’re willfully ignorant and you’re just better than them.
Don’t throw stones while living in a glass house, dude.
you know whats funny, is I have had 5 dhs on 3 bnets all around 2200 that put all of them in the top 50 for solo, but please, keep supporting my argument by pulling my check pvp lmfao
imagine being top 50 with 2200 rating? wow, its almost like the class needs buffs!
maybe you shouldn’t have aggressive opinions when you have played 16 games this season on an insanely overpowered spec?
Bwahahaha you would play the “I have multiple accounts card.”
Why you have such a hard time pushing rating on one account while you have so many that you’re just god’s gift to WoW on.
you can easily see who is me, attacko, atako, atakoo, i am not exactly hiding it brother
h ttps://check-pvp.fr/solo?region=us&realm=all&faction=all&classes=12&specs=577,581&sort=rating&order=desc&page=1&minRating=1700&bracket=shuffle
I’m not entertaining you anymore.
Obvious troll.
What’s funny tho is I literally agreed with you on a slight damage buff for Havoc, you started the immature personal attacks. But you wanna sit here and play the finger pointing game as if you didn’t.
Later dude. Gl out there.
the craziest part is not experiencing the season, which at many intervals has had different meta specs, and then having this extremely charged emotional opinion lmao, idk at this point its just what do you even tell him
I don’t have to be a five star chef to be able to tell a cook their steak is overcooked like leather and under seasoned do I?
I still keep up with class buffs/nerfs in patches, I played at start of season and didn’t like the state of the PvP scene despite playing a feral at the time from carrying it over from the end of DF (when it wasn’t meta). I keep up on the state of the game by watching different content creators like Hansol, Venruki, Snupy, etc, I still watched AWC. I don’t need to play retail everyday, 6 hours a day to know what’s wrong with the game’s current meta and balancing issues. Game hasn’t really changed much meta wise since the start of the expac. Minor tweaks but other than that, nothing really that drastic has changed from start of season till now.
Also “made up opinions” is blatantly disingenuous, an example of a literal fact I brought up was the first blood percentage, in 31.4% of games that have a Havoc DH they are the first death. It is objective to think, well if their defensives are bad and their tool kit isn’t making up for it, then why aren’t they the kill target a vast majority of game they are in? For him to state they don’t impact the matches they are in because their ST sustained damage is low, is also false because they are one of the, if not spec with the most micro cc in the game for PvP. Surely you’d want to take out the enemy that is the most defensively vulnerable, and at the same time you are keeping them pressured, disrupting their gcds by making them go on the back foot and have to play defensively, and kite at times.
That dude literally said word for word “Murlok isn’t a bible for pure science based arguments” but then in the next breath, that is all he is bringing to the discussion time and time again spamming the same link to a representation of specs being played on the ladder. That and a lot of anecdotal, subjective evidence he has claimed first hand that many people not just me, openly disagree with and have refuted. Many of us have tried to find middle ground with that dude, but then he starts throwing around words like “propaganda” which is hilarious to hear be said on a WoW forums post about balancing, and wants to then gaslight and dismiss and all opinions that don’t completely fall in line with his own.
I tried to have a dialogue with him but then he decided to be toxic and try to bring current rating into the conversation as a personal jab to my credibility, and at that moment gloves come off. It becomes fair game to me, and I’m in for some entertainment.
I think he just doesn’t understand how that representative data works, it’s like saying it isn’t hard to run an ultra marathon to time, just most people have never tried lmao.
The reason the “representation” is low at high elo is because the spec is overall bad, bad as a spec, and in the meta, and doesn’t make it to high elo. I know that’s really hard for you to grasp, we all tried really hard to help you, but we couldn’t.
What’s so hard for your grasp?
Representation doesn’t always cleanly equate to viability.
Currently in your own stats there are more Frost Dks than Unholy Dks on the ladder but there are more Unholy Dks 2400+ NA in 3s. It rank Outlaw as #2 dps but there’s only 16 2400+ NA in 3s, even more Assa than Outlaw 2400+ NA in 3s and Assa is ranked #9 on representation according to your stats.
These outliers counter using your line of thought as the pure fact of the matter, and prove there are irregularities/outliers. There was plenty more but I’m not wasting all night on this for you to cherry pick a section you feel like addressing with some more anecdote. Like cmon dude I’m using your own evidence against you at this point directly, you can keep trying to skew the actual meat of the argument with your semantic numbers game and petty anecdotes, but it’s not changing anything.
Okay so i’m just going to say this also isn’t indicitive of what’s going on within the game.
If you put a dh into a lobby with a warlock & 2 mages, ofc the DH is going to be the one that’s dying.
If you put the DH into a lobby with 2 warriors and a DK, the DH is not going to be dying.
Data in WoW isn’t something you can just sit there and say “well clearly there’s an issue because 31.4% of the time they are the ones that die first” when there are SO many other variables that can not be assessed.
(also i didnt read everything so im just nitpicking)
Sure, that’s easy to answer, Frost is better now, Unholy was insane on launch of tww (heavily nerfed since) (you arent/havent played so you didnt know this), Assa is a lot easier than outlaw, making outlaw an extreme outlier. Any more questions since you yourself admitted you didn’t play this season? You have probably spent more time here trying to argue with me than playing TWW at this point!
Frost is better in games where it’s able to get its setup easily (e.g. double melees, ramping wizards), while unholy is better into wizards that can’t break escape (boomies, spris, etc.).
Assa is harder than outlaw. Outlaw is just a reaction test.
This is my personal opinion between the two, if you disagree and believe assa is harder than outlaw, that’s fine, this was my personal takeaway. I would say that frost is probably doing better than unholy recently, but I completely agree with your separation, I will admit, I didn’t put as much effort into explaining it to him/it because at this point I am really uninterested in arguing with someone who doesn’t even play the patch
I mean your opinions and what facts are are two different things.
Outlaw is going to be harder for peolpe with slower reactions or lack of understanding niche specifics, similar in the way arcane would be harder than fire.
Frost is going to be better when all you’re qing into is stuff that can’t really escape the DK or has few ways to break the chain of slow spam with lack of counterplay, e.g. cleaves. On the flip side unholy is going to run down any boomy or spri because the specs can’t put out enough pressure to force them off, and then these are wizards that are now required to juke multiple kicks to get their windows of opportunity to happen. This also just goes to show that frost is better because it counters the meta, however its interchangeable with unholy, similarly to assa/outlaw comparisons, and it’s all based on the player themselves.
Also off topic, but any DK who complains about boomies need to mute themselves. It’s the rogue & DH that make you hate the game, not the boomy (unless you miss every kick like a freak).
Yeah either way, I really don’t even play rogue, so I wouldn’t know, my bottom line is many posts above where I stated I believe DH is weak in this expansion and needs sustained single target damage buffs outside of it’s burst windows. This is kind of runaway annotation unfortunately because a feral player who mains classic and played 4 games on TWW decided to spew nonsense for 20 posts.
I totally see your points though, especially about boomie, I think boomie even kind of falls in that territory where it could use some love too, but I am sure some boomie hater will come to witchhunt if I say that because the forum meta is to shtpost against any class you don’t play and push propa lmao
