Looking at how this has operated in the past and currently. It’s clear that the experiment to promote faction diversity did not quite hit the nail on the head. Hall of Fame for horde fills up at least 9x faster than Alliance each tier and it just builds resentment for the dying faction in order to play cross realm.
Hall of Fame should either be a prescribed time scale or close after 150/200 guilds have cleared the raid.
From my perspective as a player this should serve as an incentive to show the teams that performed well and within a specified time frame, however as us MMO players are quite competitive when the spots start to get limited guilds start to add overtime raid days/hours to try and get in before it closes which fills more spots which then causes other guilds to have the same thought process.
If a competitive aspect is added to the game, there needs to be moderation in some way.
Social aspects will be what they are, however over the last few tiers guilds have been removed from the Hall of Fame after it has closed for RMT (for this tier these trends began again weeks ago). This only adds fuel to the fire as those spots are getting filled and then removed after the domino effect has begun.
The domino effect has already begun for this tier and could be stopped with a specified cut off point rather than a player-created one.
I can say with almost certainty the guild at 100th on the HoF Horde Leaderboard will not be the same guild in a month’s time as it has been in the previous few tiers. But with the leaderboard filling up teams that have their ultimate goal to be a “HoF guild” push themselves harder in order to fill the remaining few spots when in reality if those teams did not do this the actual window for HoF would be extended by a reset due to teams being removed which then alleviates social and mental pressure from those players.
Hall of Fame as a system needs to change going forward as faction barriers are being lifted.
What happens with cross faction gameplay when that comes out. You will need to be at least 18 in the same guild for it to count as a guild group. So at most guilds can have 2 people on the opposite faction and not in the guild (as there are no announced plans for cross-faction guilds yet).
Edited: Formatting.
5 Likes
Cross realm should not be restricted for mythic until Hall of Fame opens. Mythic lockouts should work the same as heroic.
This is a hill I’m willing to die on.
10 Likes
Looking at how this has operated in the past and currently. It’s clear that the experiment to promote faction diversity did not quite hit the nail on the head.
I believe this is the biggest takeaway. The “Faction” diversity/competition isn’t really there. Horde HoF is viewed as the “HoF” and guilds will push for it and it’s even made some guilds do some crazy things to try and secure the title. This has created a very competitive/goal for guilds to push and I believe is very healthy to reward players who put such an extreme amount of time to achieve such goals.
I’m more in the boat asl well to combine the HoF’s and make it top 100 or 120(Making it 200, even 150 would significantly devalue the achievement). Tying the cross-realm to HoF would be fine if it was combined since HoF in a normal tier for Horde usually closes in ~6 weeks(This tier is a different story alongside CoS).
2 Likes
Mythic lockouts definitely should work like heroic, but not until after Hall of Fame Closes. Hall of Fame is one of the most prestigious achievements in the game, and regular lockouts would make it easier to achieve, which I believe would be counter productive.
With this said, I completely agree with Pantheaeu, at the time of posting, the hall of fame currently has 97 Horde guilds and 8 alliance guilds. Not only is this further proof of the faction imbalance, but mathematically speaking there could be over 800 horde guilds clearing the raid before Hall of Fame closes and not getting the achievement themselves. Its an unfair system to those 800 horde guilds.
My thoughts regarding the hall of fame are this:
- Top 200 guilds (regardless of faction) get Hall of Fame
- Once Hall of Fame closes:
Open cross realm mythic (as it currently is), open mythic lockouts to work like Normal/Heroic, and open additional loot methods like Master Looter and group loot for Raid.
On the flipside, by not taking things to attempt to address the faction imbalance like this, they risk making that imbalance even worse.
Right now, I’d wager a good amount of what is keeping some raid guilds Alliance is the fact they don’t have to rush for Hall of Fame.
If they removed the faction requirements for it, then what motivation do those guilds have to remain Alliance?
And as not all content is getting cross-faction, this inadvertently punishes the casual players, not the raiders, who do random dungeons, LFR, etc. as that reduces the pool of people that could be in it. (I have met more mythic raiders in random heroics and LFR than you’d probably believe)
I do understand the frustration, but at the same time, I’m sure you’ve witnessed it too - the Alliance has shrunk substantially over time, and if they just made something like Hall of Fame strictly the first X guilds, - that removes incentive to remain Alliance. Any cutting edge aiming guild would feel forced to go Horde, as that opens up the potential pool of raiders they can recruit substantially.
1 Like
Okay but I literally don’t care, I just want to be able to play mythic raids with my friends on other realms, and I know for a fact that this is hurting smaller guilds and especially smaller realms a lot. Other than that, it still requires it to be a guild kill anyway, no different from having a few pugs from your own realm.
I don’t think it makes the raid easier at all, nor the achievement. It just removes the obstacle that if you want to do mythic raiding, you have to be on a high pop realm. It also disproportionally affects those that cannot afford realm transfers, or those that don’t want to leave their friends behind.
The Hall of Fame requirement for cross realm is an old concept and it should be binned.
4 Likes
I agree with this in essence, however I feel that HoF pushing is quite unhealthy when it comes to the end of the leaderboard. As those measures can become more extreme and the once close blend of time & skill gets pushed very heavily towards time.
Ultimately it depends on what the actual intentions of HoF were and what they are going to be going forward as I don’t think it was ever clearly stated what it would achieve, it was just slapped in on a BfA build and the community built expectations around it assuming it was to drive up Alliance Participation, but all it ended up being was an Alliance Participation Trophy.
If it was a prescribed time frame to go towards then this can be used as a tuning goal for the raid. Say for example if the target was 8 weeks after mythic release = HoF, then this timeframe can be used for tuning goals as well as finding the walls in the raid. This timeframe could be extended to extinuating circumstances such as low participation (Uu’nat) or harder tuning (Sepulcher) or alternatively could be used to push the tuning goalpost so let’s say it’s week 6 and there are only 40 guilds progressing Rygelon, this would serve as a tuning point to tune down the bosses which are proving to be barriers at and before this point as it’s not “on pace”.
1 Like
Considering Hall of Fame takes ages to fill compared to Horde they should just go ahead and make it top 150 or 200 regardless of faction to make the achievement mean something for both factions. I might be wrong but I think guilds towards WR500~ are still going to be getting Famed on alliance.
As Cross-Realm raiding is opening next week, I assume that Alliance Hall of Fame will be closing.
What’s the plan for Hall of Fame in Dragonflight? (Some points in the first post of this thread for points for discussion)