Time is a commodity.
Farming mats for yourself is by no means “free”.
Very true! But what’s worth more? spending an hour to farm 20-50 pots (depending on procs) or spending 750-1500 g/pot? at the end of the day it’s a cost-benefit-analysis either way, and has always been relevant to M+/Raiding pushing in all of wow pve history!
I do agree with everyone that templates would’ve been preferable, but blizzard tuned it around standard slands gear, and left the timewalking gear loophole open so players who were not as skilled could complete the challenges by farming that other gear.
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Yeah. Pay to win.
Thats what he said.
It’s not pay to win. It involves consumables, but so does literally every raid/M+ at a high level.
So no. Wrong.
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Youre not making a point.
PVE has always required consumables @ high levels.
Thats not news.
Those consumables require either time or money to acquire.
One way or the other youre paying for it.
Thats called pay to win.
Consumables that if you are not that profession you either:
a) need to buy them
b) drop your current profession to farm specific items for ONE time gated piece of content
In the post you made, you used the best flask and best pot, which are ungodly expensive.
If this was current mythic world first type content I would totally agree with how this is being done.
But its not.
Its rehashed content with a rehashed reward that was supposed to let people who didn’t this get a chance at it.
And they dropped the ball on this with poor testing, and ’ forgetting ’ about items, IE Soul Traps.
This is poorly done, and not even comparable to Legion’s MT.
“If you don’t want to put in the work to be successful, then that’s okay.”
I have succeed at every level of content I have set out to do.
This is the first time in my 15+ years I am voicing my opinion on a subject matter.
Its not about putting in the work. Its that the work is off balance.
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Yep! But that has literally 0 to do with blizzard. And they’re not required. I used cheaper ones for just about every other challenge!
No. Wrong. Blizzard has said on every single post and interview that it was meant to be a solo challenge on par with mage tower on release. Which it is.
WDYM? It was tested and was found to be too easy, because people were clearing it easily without any optimizaton. So it was buffed.
No argument about the soul traps though, thats straight up exploiting. But also, i’m not about to go through 3000+ interactable items with NPCs to figure out what does and doesn’t work.
It is every big the same, if not easier than mage tower on release. Period. Full stop.
Great! Then use those same skills and this will be doable!
Wrong, because people have been able to complete it without any additional optimization, so there is an objective reality that this can be done.
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Fury pots are now 10k a pop on my server.
Asking nasrajin to post a video of themselves completing mage tower sans consumables.
Ill wait.
As someone who did it in Legion, it is not. A community seems to agree.
Show me? I have yet to see it. Everything I have seen has had some optimized piece of gear/flask/pot. Its even in the guides on wowhead to use this stuff.
I asked for info and it wasn’t recorded.
As fast as they got it I would been logging that crap.
Based on his kill time he was in some world first race type rankings.
How long is Mage Tower supposed to be available this time around?
One month!
The silence is deafening.
Bro, you have an attitude problem. The challenge is doable. If you struggle to complete it, then that’s on you. There’s no reason or need for me to go back and prove myself to a stranger on the forums. The fact of the matter is that people are completing it w/out timewalking gear or BFA consumables, but players CAN get and use them to help them out to make it easier. Your inability to pay for the consumables that have their prices set by the community is not in any way blizzard’s fault. All there is to it.
If you actually want help with the encounter, post a vid of your play and I’d be happy to tell you what you can work on to improve, but outside of that, there’s no need to reply
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No attitude here.
I just find it hypocritical that youve been here the past few days calming its 100% skill and not at all make or break on consumables/gear.
You yourself needed them to complete it.
Thats not up for debate.
When did I ask for help?
Consumables =/= timewalking gear. That is a clear and obvious distinction to seemingly everyone but yourself. everything everything EVERYTHING is tuned around consumables. Because if they’re NOT tuned around them, and then make them available, then there’s no longer a challenge because people will be doing 10-20% more damage than the encounter was tuned for.
It’s probably actually doable w/out consumables now, though, but that’s a separate conversation.
Maybe you should start 
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The more you speak the more you dig this hole.
Tell me again why that isnt pay to play?
Get a load of this guy, making assumptions.
Cute.
still waiting…
Who said anything about timewalking gear.
Becuase everyone has that in their bags.
More assumptions made by you.
Solo pve content is now gated based on pvp?
Tell me again how its 100% skill.
I dont care what the issue is…
Taking twice as long to do content that is 2 expansions old than when it was new and built for the good gear at the time is stupid and idiotic.
My son got 30 out of 36 classes of the mage tower stuff back in Legion. Today he quit after his 10th attempt on Guardian Druid (he did Guardian Druid on 3 of them back in legion his and 2 friends). He agrees it definitely is twice as hard NOW than it was back THEN and there is no reason for this.
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No one has an attitude problem.
We are having a really good discussion and disagreeing on how things are done.
Really, if anything, you’re being slightly hypocritical when saying ’ you don’t need this stuff ', but you used it, then say ’ its a part of the game ’ then we complain that its needed and over priced or takes extreme effort to get.
You don’t need to prove yourself, but you are the one saying ’ I did it this way ', which based on timing, pulls, and status (IE gear) you’re in the running for some top 0.1% stuff.
For all we know you used Soul Trap and every BiS slot for it. If you’re going to offer advice you should have a way of proving it rather than ’ lets go, champ '.
Your sentiment is appreciated, but it doesn’t change the fact the fight is off and poorly executed.
The challenge is doable, no one is disputing that. You found a needle in the haystack, congrats, not taking that away from you, not saying you didn’t deserve your kill.
But, you can’t expect others to find a needle as well.
Look at the community kills now and feedback, vs how it was in Legion.
There was a small, small percentage of people complaining back then (which, people always will), but no where near the broad scale it is now.
This is not comparable to Legion.
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You guys are being ridiculous. And for what it’s worth, Tical absolutely has an attitude. He always has. Incredibly argumentative, especially regarding semantics.
E.g
Like obviously pay to win as a phrase since the history of, forever, has meant with money. You’re really going to dig the “free doesn’t exist” hole and apply it to a basic P2W model for a video game? Just stop.
As someone else who also completed this with only slands gear and basic consumables, I can attest it can be done. I didn’t do it as fast as Nas (not the guardian one anyway) but it was still a couple hour ordeal. I did use a flask and oil for all attempts since they persist through death and one stack of pots/food for when I felt I could definitely get it. That’s it. No special gear, no old enchants, no pre potting before you go in, etc. I had between 1-2 infernals (mostly 2 I think) going into P2. I averaged like 750 dps in P1 and by the end I’d be at like 900ish due to the plethora of mobs in P2.
I didn’t record it, because I don’t record anything. And that shouldn’t have to be done for you to acknowledge others have done it. I mean I had people watch a couple on discord? I have friends who I was speaking to saying like “this would be free with the mech trinket but I don’t need it, I can do without.” Should we pull character witnesses? I mean c’mon. We have no reason to lie, there’s plenty of people doing it on video with “mega gear hacks” and it’s wayyyyyy easier that way. But it’s not required. I promise if you had specific issues or recordings of your failed attempts we could point out areas of improvement.
I disagree. I recall trying just as hard and spending similar hours on the last guardian one. Perhaps the variance in memories come from the fact that eventually, you could put gear it. So depending on when you did it, it was easy or hard. As someone who’s done it week 1 both times, I can attest it’s about the same. I even told my wife if she remembered back in California when I tried this and was stoked to get it. Said I was gonna do it again. It was almost exactly the same experience.
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