Sucks, so tired of losing rolls week after week. Running 4/5 toons through lfr/some norm since week 1 and have yet to win a roll on tier, on any toon. I have won like 3 out of 90 rolls.
feels great
inb4 oh it would be the same on personal loot…
highly doubt it
7 Likes
I’m not a fan either. Not because of decreased loot chance, but because it creates a sense that you are competing against other people for loot. AKA, you didn’t win because the other person rolled on it - did they really need it? The result is needless loot drama. With personal loot, you get the loot and it’s yours, no one is rolling against you. Sure, you can still trade it, but no, it’s not the same.
We simply don’t need more things that create drama during raids, etc. And to be clear, it’s bad for people on both sides. If I roll on something that is a tiny upgrade for me, that makes me look like a jerk to the person who it’s a huge upgrade for. But I don’t want to feel pressured to pass on items that are an upgrade for me, even if they are a tiny upgrade.
10 Likes
Hopefully PL will probably be back next expansion. Literally all of the reasons as to why it was removed in the first place are just happening again with guilds and masterloot. PL is and always will be the superior loot system unless you’re an officer benefiting from funneling yourself. If they want to keep the system they either need to open catalyst much sooner than they currently are and also bring back bonus rolls. Another alternative would be doing what they did for SL S4 fated and give you a currency like FFXIV does that can be spent on anything you want.
3 Likes
iF iT wAs pL yOu sTiLl wOuLdNt gEt lOoT.
Just wanted to say it before someone else did. Group loot sucks for LFR, should have never been added.
5 Likes
It’s true though.
The same amount of items drop in both systems.
Why does he think his luck would be better and he would be winning the PL roll that determines who gets gear?
2 Likes
No it’s not.
2 Likes
Why do you feel he would win the roll to get loot on PL?
2 Likes
I’m honestly seeing more problems with group loot compared to personal loot.
During season one, I was in a different guild at the time and people were needing on a 398 neck when they had a 404 lariat equipped. The GM had to step in and correct things. The people who unnecessarily needed said they just hit the need button without thinking.
In LFR, two warglaives dropped. I was the only DH. I only got one of the two glaives, as the second glaive was given to a greeder. You know, because I can’t have two of the same item even though I’m the only DH… hope the druid enjoys it.
What really bothers me is in LFR the same person getting multiple pieces of gear while I get nothing. Ridiculous.
3 Likes
All loot is Hunter loot.
2 Likes
People are the ones causing the drama. If you consider something rolling against you in GL any different than someone going into a raid with PL to try and win items, your thinking is the issue. Under both systems, people are competing for a limited number of drops and the current GL is actually better because it allows for passing and unrestricted trades.
The only determining factor as to if someone should be able to win an item is “did they participate in the fight,” not “does player A think player B deserves it”
No system is best for all types of groups. PL works best for groups that do not raid together consistently and most players are simply concerned with loot for themselves in that singular run. PL can also work best for consistent groups that are heavily skewed toward a small number of classes since it ensures items that can’t be used don’t drop. It’s really dumb that LFR was moved over to GL.
GL works best for consistent groups where all members agree on a given loot system and have even a modicum of variety with their class distribution. Between the restrictions on rolls, free trading, and equal distribution of loot types reducing how many rings and necks you get, a consistent group that isn’t stacking raids in split runs intentionally will gear up faster under GL than PL.
Depending how you experience raid, you will have vastly different opinions of GL and PL. If Blizzard is only going to offer a single system, one of these groups is going to be unhappy.
And under PL those players would have gotten the 398 neck and been expected to trade it. The potential for drama still exists for with those players, just in a different form.
On the other side, if those players had a 380 neck and simply needed a bit more primal chaos to craft their lariats, they wouldn’t have been able to trade the 398 neck they got even though it would be useless for them by the end of the night.
Not all guilds have people that are in it for themselves when it comes to loot. There are a lot of guilds that would welcome master looter back because loot drama is just not a concern for them. This goes far deeper than just the top 1% of guilds, too. A lot of guilds have out-of-game ways to determine who gets loot based on what they think is fair and helps the guild achieve its goals the best. So long as everyone agrees with the system and the guild leadership isn’t corrupt, having master looter (or using group loot like master looter) isn’t the cesspool of abuse that many people make it out to be for their situation.
This is more of a social issue than a chance at loot issue. While it’s frustrating to not win something while someone else gets multiple items, that stroke of luck could have easily been you instead. On average, these kinds of situations even out.
Yes, PL should be used in LFR without a doubt. But that’s because the social aspects of loot are more important in groups of pure PUGs than with consistent groups.
2 Likes
I’m personally of the opinion it should be personal loot for queued content (LFR/LFD), and group choice (ML, PL, GL) when you’re making your own group. Do people sometimes take advantage of ML/GL in pre-made groups? Yes sometimes, but you have a much more active role in who you’re grouping with in a pre-made group.
1 Like
PL would not have the better effect people hoping for
we would still get the “not fair the high ilvl player in lfr not trading loot to the low ilvls threads”
one thing might help/might not help are tokens for the wing
wing one token only for wing one items
Maybe I’m wrong, but didn’t PL have BLP so you were guaranteed a piece after however many loot opportunities? Also, PL allowed me to go back and do LFR for transmog and have more than a snowball’s chance in hell of getting any.
Edit: To clarify, in non-pugs, group loot is obviously the superior system, but PL in LFR seems like the better option, to me.
2 Likes
They just need raids to drop more loot btw. People could get no loot out of PL too.
2 Likes
PL did not have a BLP last expansion in all wings of lfr i got gold and some anima that was it
Yes, this is a game with real people.
The difference is that it rubs it in people’s faces, whereas Personal Loot was more passive.
Group Loot = “I rolled against you and won the item”.
Personal Loot = “The game gave me the item”.
With Group Loot you have situations where “I would have won the item if you didn’t roll need for it!”. That didn’t happen with Personal Loot.
Except that in reality, that’s not how it works. People get mad when they lose rolls to people who seemingly didn’t actually need it.
Even if it’s the same number of items being distributed among the same number of people, Group Loot turns it into an in-your-face competition. When people get frustrated at not getting a certain item, that frustration ends up aimed at other players instead of the game.
We’re talking about human nature. It’s not always logical. Certain ways of doing things can provoke drama more than others, even if it’s technically the “same”.
5 Likes
No, PL did not have bad luck protection.
And since with PL the total drops were determined by raid size, BLP for one person would literally be taking chances away from someone else. It would be a nightmare.
1 Like
You do understand that every time you didn’t receive loot under personal loot, that meant you “lost a loot roll” right? The only difference is you didn’t actually get to decide on which loot you wanted to roll, the system did it for you.
1 Like
In reality, people thinking they determine what others deserve controls this issue.
PL - I’m going in this raid to get whatever I can get is literally no different than GL -im going in this raid to get what I can get.
Anyone who can’t understand that is the problem. Not the system.