Yes i’m talking about MM hunter, fury/arms, WW, fix their burst, also warriors consistent dmg seems a little high.
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Blizzard don’t care.
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AWC is completely dominated by Mage + Feral/Rogue but the casual gamer know it better of course and want Hunter, Warrior and WW to be nerfed → Groundhog Day!
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Uh huh LMAO
Use defensives/LoS.
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https://imgur.com/a/sYxcu1A
What’s wrong with burst?
why should casuals care about what goes on in the AWC (e.g., the top < 0.1% of players)? I personally couldn’t care less about the wow arena prowess of a few dozen neck beards that have dedicated their lives to wow arena and are therefore able to do what 99.99% of the player base can’t, and I’d say that all or at least most casuals feel the same way.
Balancing around the top 0.1%, while it does have a logical basis, is not healthy for a game like wow imo [e.g., it alienates casuals, which ultimately has a negative impact on participation and/or the health of the game].
casuals are mostly playing shuffle to get their arena fix, so it makes sense that they’d want to see balance changes that make sense in shuffle (not that make sense for the top 0.1% of players), which currently aren’t being made [e.g., while I don’t necessarily agree with op on arms being an issue, mm hunter, fury and ww are among (if not exactly) the most overperforming specs in shuffle].
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So here’s the thing. It isn’t super easy to balance the game around the lower end. For low rated players generally the most broken things are just the easiest or cheesiest. So either they’d have to nerf every single low skill floor spec so that they’d never be more than mid tier to higher rated players. So the second joe schmoe the frost mage learns what more than 2 of his buttons can do, the fury warrior will be completely obsolete. The other option is to make every easy spec harder to play, which also isn’t good for the casual gamer since everything would be too hard for them. Some people really enjoy the shiny button simulator dps rotation that a lot of those easy specs have.
Definitely skill issues
I get that. I don’t think they should balance for the bottom end either. The net that they cast for balancing I think should try to capture as many players as possible.
Easier said than done I know, but realistically buffing/nerfing things based on awc representation imo does nothing for casuals, and if anything, it often makes their gaming experience worse.
I get that easier specs like fury or bm hunter, while dominating brackets outside of awc, if nerfed, would then get zero representation in awc (if this isn’t already the case idk), but at the end of the day, most (if not all) casuals would rather see meaningful buffs/nerfs to the specs that are actually impacting their gaming experience.
E.g., while the upcoming frost mage nerfs are merited and especially justified and/or good for the game when you consider glad-awc level gameplay in 3v3, there is no other bracket where frost mages are overperforming, and as such, casuals will suffer to appease <0.1%-0.5% of the player base (or they just reroll or quit).
In shuffle as an example (e.g., that will affect me personally), which is the most popular arena bracket for various reasons, fury is already by far the most dominant spec, followed closely by multiple hunter specs and shadow priests. Frost mages are already horrible into most of these specs, and could probably be one of the only reasons that fury warriors don’t have 500% more representation at higher ratings, yet the tunings we’re about to get are clearly being made based around gameplay possibilities that only affect less than 1% of players [e.g., I’d honestly just reference spec and comp representation at around 2400+ as a starting point for balance change consideration, but I’d absolutely not care about what Whazz, Raiku, etc. are able to do in the awc].
I understand that it’s all easier said than done to balance wow arena, especially since it’s primarily a pve game, which is why I personally don’t really care about the waves of nerfs/buffs (especially with how easy it is to multi-class now).
they need to eliminate tiered skill levels from their design philosophy completely when it comes to pvp. balance it as its own instanced game.
new players are not going to join either way. we are going to queue into each other until they shut the servers down. they need to assume that any remaining pvp players have a base skill level, balance around that, and tune raiders separately.
i don’t think they balance to the lowest common denominator, i think they are just bad and don’t have anyone good at pvp on staff. but if they are, they need to stop and just balance for the remaining 10k of us so we stick around
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thats hilarious that you think arms warr is a threat in pvp. arms has always been the noob stomper spec good at BELOW AVERAGE ratings but falls of drastically at ABOVE AVERAGE ratings 
Fury needs a higher skillcap. Slayer needs to be removed.
Because it shows what good players are capable off. So when they can’t handle it, its them not the balancing!
Don’t get me wrong, I can definitely understand that they want more fun, but why can’t they understand that other players also want to have fun? And when they already get dominated by other specs/comps on higher ratings and those casuals want the gap to get even further, why should they care about the casuals?
If you want to change the balance on lower ratings, we need to change the class designs completely across the board or disable all classes except for one! But guess what: they will still continue to cry!
Objectively they could start to add different balancing attempts based on the mmr people play on. But even though that would be smart, I doubt the devs want to have so much additional consistent work with it!
I think it ultimately boils down to the fact that people reaching multi-r1/awc level are such an incredible minority that it’s just more logical to focus on the majority as opposed to a fraction of the community that has turned this game into a full time job/obsession. This game should not be primarily balanced for people who have turned the game into an unhealthy obsession that their lives revolve around (imo). It should be balanced for people that understand that the game is just that, a game.
The same community of people at the high end you’re referencing as also wanting to have fun, which they don’t have when certain specs/comps are more dominant than others, are the exact same community of people that readily hop on the fotm train to play whatever the meta specs/comps are, and in turn they just exacerbate their own issue(s).
At the end of the day, there is/are always going to be 1-2 specs/comps that dominate the rest when played at/near perfection as is the case in the awc. Right now it’s rogue/feral mage, another week it will be jungle, next month it will be thunder or kfc, etc.
But the level of play at/near the awc level is not an accurate reflection of 99.9+% of what players experience and/or will ever be subjected to, so it seems like a less than ideal way to balance around.
E.g., 99.99% of players can’t make unholy dk work or can’t find the same success that Petkick can with it (or like pika used to do with rogue), but just because 1 or a few guys can pop off on unholy dk by playing at a pro level, that shouldn’t mean that we need to nerf unholy dks.
E.g., 99.99% of players can’t make fury warrior work in the awc, but that doesn’t mean that fury warriors need to be buffed.
Everything is more complicated due to this being an mmo with so many classes/specs, so at the end of the day they have to pick something to balance around, and balancing around awc isn’t necessarily a bad idea. I just think there is a better way (that perhaps would require more effort from blizzard).
Not sure if we are on the same page with the phrase “lower” ratings. What do you regard as lower? I’m not suggesting we start balancing for the 1600-2100 range or anything like that. I’m still talking about balancing around higher ratings, but not to the extremity of what gets played by awc players.
That is quite a wall of text.
The thing is, he is asking exclusively for Fury, MM and WW. So he is most likely maining a WL/Shadow and while its true that those are hard for those wizards, he could just play a Mage and laugh about them (at least about the melees). That is how the balance in this game was for expansions now.
If you fix Fury and WW for Warlocks and Shadows, they won’t be viable anymore to the other classes/comps and the pool of playable classes just becomes smaller. And here we could also argue, that melee classes like Warrior, Ret, DK, WW and DH are in total a lot more popular than all other DPS specs combined, especially on lower ratings.
Wouldn’t it make sense, based on your opinion, to mostly respect the casuals by keeping those classes strong on all mmrs? I mean, most casuals are playing them!
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Yeah, I can see that perspective as well [e.g., nerfing frost mage for example improves the experience for the more popular warriors, dh, etc. playing at lower mmr].
I guess there would be tradeoffs either way things are done, and balancing around awc isn’t necessarily the most horrible way to do it.
I just wish there was a better way to go about it that would simultaneously allow all ratings to feel fairly well-balanced. I actually give blizzard props on their general balancing tbh, at least for dps specs.
Other than retpocolypse in DF, a few one shot antics in SL and BfA, and bm hunters at one point this expansion, I think they’ve done a pretty good job with dps balance recently.
For healer balancing though I feel that they could be doing a lot better job.
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I agree with that and I already mentioned that they could achieve that better than now by making balancing for several “mmr brackets”, so more average players who can’t get everything out of their class, often because it requires more skill than others, aren’t having such a hard time.
On the other hand that would require them to invest a lot of time to a minority of players, if we compare it with all WoW players. And also would we need to ask the question: Would they stop crying? I don’t think so! They would still cry to give their frustration of losing some space.
I also agree with that. While the healer balancing could use some work, I think the DPS balancing is currently not as awful as some people are trying to make it. In fact, I think its quite decent and only some shifts are needed.
For WW, which I main, I would like to see some nerfs to the 4 set. Its currently 40% in PvP, so go ahead with 32% and see how that feels.
Fury need some slight tuning to execute which seems wild in some situations → saw a 5.3M execute (both weapons) which seems a bit high for an instant ability with no CD or channeling time!
But they should only aim for the massive spikes, not the normal damage. So maybe try to experiment with lower crit modifiers in PvP. Try 35% instead of 50% for example.
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bro what lol.
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yeah I have to actually back team warrior on this one. Arms is not an issue atm, only fury is.