I been playing another class for this expansion. But I wanted to get back on my ret pally that I have let sit awhile. My question is which is the better hero talent spec to go to… I plan on doing more solo and delves, using single target and using my aoe. Maybe some mythics down the road at some point. Whats the better choice?
In PVE, they are very close to each other to be honest.
(If we are to believe the sims and assuming they aren’t broken anymore)
That being said, Herald is easier to play and offers more healing for solo play.
I would strongly advise trying both.
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This x 1000.
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Id try both to see which one you enjoy more as they are a bit different but Herald is kind of the go to soloing hero talent.
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For me it’s dot vs burst spec. Herald of the Sun adds a dot, while Templar adds burst. I love dots, so I play Herald. I like the beams, the dots, the numbers. It’s also simpler, because the rotation remains pretty much the same.
I haven’t played Templar a lot, but from what I heard it’s more about bigger hits, and it modifies your rotation a bit.
Murloc io shows that most high-rated people use Herald in M+ and PvP.
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Practically speaking, Herald is better in all content. Even in single-target fights, where sims suggest Templar should perform marginally better, actual logs show Herald pulling ahead by hundreds of thousands of DPS.
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Yeah but is it because the sims are broken? The in-game mechanic is broken?
Or that only the “bad” players are playing Templar making it look worse than it actually is?
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I tested them on the dummy according with the specified rotation and it’s noticeably worse than Herald, i think humans can’t match the timings of the sims to be able to sustain Shake the Heaves as well as it.
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This what I’m wondering as well.
But to which extend can we not follow as to create such a discrepancy?
Which source are you using for the rotation?
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Wowhead guide/hammer of wrath discord guide stuff since it’s the same.
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Unless everyone running Templar is bad, I think we can rule that out. Logs show a consistent discrepancy across all levels of play, and no one playing Templar is approaching Herald DPS.
There are a couple of bugs with Templar (Hammer of Light resets the swing timer, and its GCD isn’t affected by haste), but I don’t think those can explain the difference of hundreds of thousands of DPS.
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i mean, theres a bug. a very nasty bug thats making specific things doing more damage than it should. also please consider that herald is doing way better in aoe and cleave which the majority of these fights are compared to templar
in pure st, they should be simliar. also keep in mind everyone is defaulting to herald cause of better healing and ease of access
Tuning aside, Herald feels better to play then Templar imo
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Herald not inly does more damage, its infinitely easier to play not even a comparison
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Anyone who cares about their performance won’t, which is to say most of the good players.
So it’s probably looking worst than it is.
It’s not a new phenomenon, it’s the same thing that happens for pure DPS specs.
The best player are playing the best spec leaving those who don’t care to play the specs that are marginally worse.
It’s not to say there aren’t dedicated player that are really good with their “sup-optimal” spec, but they aren’t enough to offset the rest.
I’m not making this up. It’s documented.
Look at the disclaimer of every performance review posted on wowhead
The idea of this article is to give a perspective of the current state of class balance for The War Within Season 1, meaning this is an incomplete picture of balance.
We say perspective, as there are inherent biases in looking at the data this way.
Specs considered underpowered are generally played less and tend to appear weaker than they are.
Just to re-iterate, people don’t play Templar for a reason. It’s damage is evidently not as reliable and it makes it weaker by comparison in group play, no doubt.
And something should probably be done.
But for solo play where mobs will always be on you, it’s not much of an issue.
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Yes, performance-oriented players gravitate towards the best performing specs (or sub-specs in this case), but I’m not just talking about averages. I’m saying that the top-performing Templar players, across all difficulties, are not in the same region as the top-performing Herald players. Even on the fights where Templar is closest to Herald, there is still a ~20% difference in DPS.
It’s possible that the absolute best Herald players are better the absolute best Templar players, but can that explain such a huge discrepancy? Is it believable that not a single person of comparable skill has logged a kill as Templar on any boss across every difficulty?
No, the mechanic of Templar are laid bare and it just can’t efficiently gets it’s damage out at least clearly in raid.
Not within the current paradigm.
And as Rayzen pointed out, the timing required to achieve the same numbers as the sim on prolonged fight might be humanly impossible to achieve.
On short burst fights it might not make much of a difference, for having played Templar in some keys, my overall didn’t seem to be much affected between both specs.
In raid though, it is significantly harder.
This is my anecdotal experience.
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Each their own. I find Templar vastly more fun to play than herald.
its not hard tho
also
this isnt impossible either. like other specs are harder and have more complex rotations than shake the hammer. it just not something ret players worry about doing rn cause herald is just “do your df rotation and get tons more damage” cause almost every boss but 2 has some form of add cleave.
ultimately templar doesnt bring anything to the table in this raid. unlikely in any raid this expansion unless they buff its cleave potential or rets main cleave potential
Underrated aspect is how busted Herald self healing is, eternal flame crits can take you from nearly dead to full health.