There are those who would disagree. After all why would a fragment of an actual Wild God be susceptible to CC, not absolutely merc everything in sight, etc. Plus I’m pretty sure being a glorified BM hunter when we pop our CDs isn’t very much in line with the WW class fantasy of being “a martial artist without peer who pummels foes with hands and fists.” That’s literally the spec description.
You must not have read the post because it’s far closer to shaman Ascendence rather than just an output buff.
No I’m not just referring to him in PvP, but damn did he not need to be more susceptible to CC from classes that can make him sit pretty hard already. He’s quite underwhelming PvE side too.
Go argue with the developers of the game, because they’re explanation literally says the Gods lend monk some of their power. Which means Xuen is directly in line with that explanation. The god isn’t being cc’d or any other drivel you make up. He’s lending them a small fraction of his power.
You know, if you went a page further, you’d see the very description of the spec I quoted. Hell, even in the class information that’s on the page you linked, it’s stated that “Whatever their combat role, monks rely mainly on their hands and feet to do the talking, and on strong connection with their inner Chi to power their abilities.”
It honestly just looks like you opened up the “Game” tab on the main page, saw the monk class, and linked it without bothering to read it. But go on, we can keep arguing semantics and flavor if you want.
Pssst… here’s a pro-tip. None of what you post makes any sense when you continue to ignore the fact that Xuen is a portion of the power provided to the monk by the god. It isn’t the actual god, who you’re complaining about being cc’d. You’re purposefully leaving off the part about the celestials being a pivotal part of the monk class because it makes your argument silly.
Psst… here’s a pro-tip. Learn to read because I never said we were summoning the actual Xuen. I clearly said fragment in my post you quoted. Secondly, while lore supports powerful entities being containable, it certainly isn’t done by cheap on the fly answers from the murder hobos (the colloquial term for the playerbase) even if it’s a fragment.
Read the page you linked me. It literally goes over Monks relying on inner chi and all that jazz. Only one small section mentioning the August Celestials lending power to us. And just speaking in the history of the actual class, the more the Celestials have been involved with the actual specs, the less optimal it’s been.
So, back to that PvP point you made… supposing a team is chain cc’ing your celestial, maybe you use that time to do damage on the fools who chose to cc a pet.
Maybe you should play Enhancement and be done with those silly celestials. Getting rid of them would be no different than wanting to remove Loa from the Zandalari. Literal gods that stop what they’re doing to help mortals.
If only the vast majority of CC Xuen got hit with wasn’t Mass Root, Frost Nova, Psychic Scream, other AoE Fear from locks, etc. I wish people committed Poly/casted fear and root/hex on Xuen.
I have. I don’t feel like trading a cat for dogs, and a rocky boi.
I ain’t saying get rid of them lorewise. I like the theme/art style. I’m saying axe the ability to summon Xuen as the default and just have his empowerment of us be him juicing us up to do gnarly things instead of summoning a smaller version of him. Sorta like the bosses from Zul’aman. Minus the murdering a friendly woodland creature thing.
I should’ve learned my lesson with you in the aoe post where you won’t be happy unless WW is literally overpowered… Do you know just how stupid it is to suggest Xuen shouldn’t be cc’able in pvp because it’s a “fragment of a god”?
No my misguided fellow, you should have learned to read carefully first.
As for this. This is a bit of a two parter. CCing CDs has long been a staple of PvP. However, Xuen doesn’t stack enough bodies to warrant being made more vulnerable to CC. I’m willing to bet that more often than not, Xuen isn’t landing KBs and it’s usually a juiced RSK crit or ToD that ends things.
As a fragment of a wild god that WW is stuck with summoning, it’s rather disappointing that he’s stopped with as much ease as the other CD we’re more or less stuck with, SEF. As I’ve said in a response from someone else, the vast majority of CC Xuen usually gets hit with is AoE CC and usually stray ones at that. It’d be far more fitting to have to commit something to stopping Xuen, so rather than Xuen being thrown off by every AoE CC under the sun make him only vulnerable to single target CC/stuns to make opponents have to commit something to stopping him. Make a shaman commit their hex, or make a mage/druid/lock sac their poly/single target root/single target fear. Hell, Druids have two methods outside of mass root to single target stop Xuen.
So to answer your question. It’s about as stupid as Xuen being stopped by stray AoE CC rather than him requiring reasonable commitment to stall. And it wouldn’t be as annoying an issue if we weren’t stuck with him as the default.
Now run along and go take the time to go read the monk class page you linked carefully. Or don’t. It hardly matters.
I love that people come in here to trash your (correct) observation that Xuen is a prop or a gag.
Come join the dark side and play Outlaw Rogue or Enhancement Shaman for the Damage Monk Experience. New Outlaw PvP talents include “Enduring Brawler” and “Float Like A Butterfly”. Definitely not Monk-sounding skills there…
Their class fantasy for Windwalker Monk is too far gone; they can ruin what’s left of it at this point.
Just so you guys know, lending a fragment of their power can be something else other than literally summoning an avatar (or effigy, whatever). Adding Lightning effects to our blows, enhancing our physical capabilities, etc, are all forms of lending one’s power to us.
Now, maybe it would be better in PvP if Xuen was immune or at least resistant (like less duration, idk) to AoE CC specifically. A Frost Nova or Mass Roots is all it takes to literally negate 66% of a WW Monk’s offensive cooldowns AND actually reduce their damage due to how SEF works if the Monk frees himself from the CC.
I like Xuen way more than I like SEF because Xuen at least isn’t nearly as buggy, but I’d be lying if I said I wouldn’t prefer a cooldown that would directly empower my character instead of summoning 37 pets with terrible AI and a multitude of bugs.
To sum it up, I say kill SEF before looking at Xuen.
The major difference is I can ignore SEF and be content. I can’t lose Xuen’s damage contribution though.
Personally, I’d rather see Serenity replace Xuen than SEF. Give ME Gale Burst / Tiger Lightning (or just Multistrike, please)… So maybe opposite ends of the same side.
Again though, even with that there’s something tedious and unfun about rotating Tiger Palms between every skill. Fury Warrior short cooldowns are far more exciting, so who knows. Monk needs some attention but since these other classes are getting Monk skills, I don’t think there’s any real hope for the spec to be anything than a PvP meme.
Hey all, can we just, you know, mark this guy as spam? We don’t need a Blizz derp coming along, seeing a title with lots of comments, and just immediately removing one of …
Honestly wouldn’t mind talents that let us go down the celestials providing support route more than we have now, as Xuen outside of being able to break CC with his lighting doesn’t really seem all that bad.
SEF does really need to be changed to something else though. Even after the supposed changes to I could swear I still see them pull other mobs not in combat now and then (along with very rarely facing the wrong way some times when attacking an enemy).
They actually could keep mark of the crane and just have something else help with the spread of it like damage from FoF or the like (or maybe have it so that when you rising sun kick, or blackout kick an enemy with mark of the crane it spreads it to a mob nearby).
I mean I was thinking it, but this thread was focused on Xuen. Though, I could see Fury of Xuen from BfA replace Hit Combo on the talent tree. That would be a far more tolerable way to see Xuen pop up.
I think SEF is salvageable as an idea for an ability. However, the way it is/how it was ported over from WC3:TFT to be a burst ability was done poorly. Original SEF had a far more elemental theme to it and each spirit did different things. One of them was a ranged lightning wizard, one was a fiery face puncher with immo aura, and another was a magic immune/resistant tank and they all clapped pretty hard and you had full control over each spirit.
Current SEF is a lot closer to the Blademaster’s Mirror Images except they’re used for damage. I think it’d be interesting to see Blizz rework SEF as a mobility/utillity type of tool like Samuro’s Mirror Images in HotS. I believe there was talk of letting monks teleport between their images, which is what Samuro does/did (since last i checked) if you went for images build in HotS. Its implementation would be odd though, and almost exclusively only see use in PvP unless WW really needed the mobility to get somewhere/to a target in a raid.
I could see a redesign of SEF around its elemental style, but it would be a lot work on Blizz’s end. It could just be redesigned around a talent row where we choose an element to focus on for SEF. And the talent could augment what goes on during SEF. i.e. If we choose the earth spec talent we get magic immune during SEF, or if we choose storm we get ranged attack, etc. Something along those lines.
