Chicken-egg argument. Is M+ the most popular because it’s basically replaced two raid levels for gear or is it popular because people actually like doing the same dungeon over and over again?
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Blizzard has two different esport events for M+. Maybe, just maybe, people do actually like M+?
maybe they like infinite 8 dungeon rotations better than doing the same 1 raid every week
You’ll get rid of most of the game then, because most of the game is not part of the current max level gearing hamster wheel for elite players.
Probably because you don’t need to get a group of 20 people just to wipe because of 3 for 6-9 hours a week and only play at a specific set time you need to make sure you have open every week. Raiding sucks in modern gaming… Only like 2% of players have a single mythic kill and sub 10% have an AOTC kill.
M+ is the ideal modern gaming format, grab your pick-up-group, get right into the content and go. It’s how every modern game works aside from aging MMOs.
This would be amazing. The main reason I only do M+ is because I can jump in whenever I have time. The whole second job part of raiding isn’t really an option anymore.
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It’d be interesting to find out. Personally that’d be an expansion I wouldn’t buy.
I have no idea what “esport” even is and have no interest. I just want to hang and play with my friends and am willing to pay for a game that’s playable at that level.
My friends and I love to get on and raid. We play most weeknights anyway so putting one as a raid night means everyone gets to play together instead of splitting off into 5-man groups. Problem is even in normal this expansion one player not paying attention can wipe the group over and over. The DPS checks in normal are also to where we have trouble carrying anyone and there’s always going to be a carry or two in a casual guild.
So don’t play WoW? M+ is just a treadmill of the same content over and over and over… We usually get a fresh raid each tier.
I’d quit. I don’t like M+ enough to pay a sub for it without raiding. M+ ruins the social aspect of WoW. My guild will have 13 people in disc and everyone is squabbling about which keys, who gets left out, which healer has to go DPS because there’s only 2 slots, and trying not to get stuck with “that guy” who we’d just carry in raid but he’s probably going to brick whatever key he’s in. Then we jump to 5-person channels and all conversation pretty much comes to a grinding halt. On raid night all 13 can play together and we have more fun… except the Shadowlands raids have been overtuned and there are too many wipe nights. Given the poor gear, normal raid should be way easier.
I guess its kind of refreshing to see someone like you to come back to a thread and admit that they never had a clue what they were talking about.
You’re doing raiding wrong if all you care about is gear.
Grats? Doesn’t change raid being the minority content now.
No. Remove the stupid, limiting Mythic must be 20 man feature. Make it scale like the rest.
Raid difficulties are fine.
LFR suits casual players who don’t have the time to schedule a full raid run or for players just trying to push some alts.
Normal is good for casual guilds and new raiders
Heroic is good for guilds who want a challenge but don’t want the severity of Mythic.
Mythic is good for the people who want the hardest content.
We don’t need to delete any of them.
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no one requires you to raid that much.
Its called a choice
Cut the current version of normal and go back to normal/heroic.
but, bring back Ulduar style hard mode fights.
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Just make 1 raid for the entire expansion and then give it the keystone mechanic for the entirety of the expansion.
lol
Get rid of mythic raiding and make mythic gear just heroic
Yes, just like paying for a subscription is a choice. The time commitment required to participate in WoW raiding has made the choice very easy for many people.
They have either started only doing M+ or cancelled thier subs altogether
Blizz needs to improve game accessibility or they will continue to lose players
This is how our guild raid group works now. At the height of our raid size we managed less than 30 players. Usually around 25 at the most, then as the season progressed it dropped precipitously to less than 20.
At present we are lucky if we can form up 12-15 players, however, most recently we went in with 11 players. Our raiding group is basically casual with a few outliers popping in every once in a while, because they just happened to be available. At present we are still working through normal and have only two more bosses before we complete it.
Historically our group starts Heroic after finishing normal. On a few occasions before we finish normal, we will venture into the first boss on heroic, to see if we can down him, since we all know the dance mechanics.
The main complaint is the lack of adequate drops, even from trash mobs, we actually saw disappear with the newer raids. We used to help players upgrade gear because of extra drops from trash. But since that has basically been nerfed, some folks who might have been inclined to join us, have stepped out.
Our guild is mainly older players with families and other real life obligations, so we don’t take raiding as a mainstay for our grouping. We raid twice a week and only for about 1.5 hour, sometimes pushing to 2 hrs if we are a few points away from actually downing the current boss. More often when this happens, our group pushes through and succeeds with that last pull.
But many of our members are rather disappointed in how bliz has handled the raiding and dungeon drops this season overall. Our biggest problem is: in order to upgrade that last pc of gear using valor, the player is required to do higher and higher M+ keys just to get 1 or two more upgrade levels on a single pc.
I doubt I shall see anything past a 9 or 10 key this season on my healer. I am not a heavy mythic dungeon runner and enjoy other things than beating my head against a timed run and not get what I needed anyway.
Requiring M+ dungeon runs to get higher and higher tier runs, in order to qualify for the next level upgrade, is the worst idea I’ve seen. It needs to be separated from raiding all together so that those who do not do M+ keys can obtain the necessary currency, AND qualify to upgrade the raid drops.
In my opinion, having raiding drop upgrades based on valor requirement level upgrades from mythic dungeons is horribly imbalanced. So many of our raiders do not want to run Mythic dungeons, and those few will step out when they reach a road block to upgrading a really valuable pc of gear, because the only way to upgrade it, even one more level, is to participate in an activity they truly do not want to do.