I been reading a lot of threads where people want to remove the barrier of entry from pvp gear so that it’s more competitive. I’m assuming most of this is from people that primarily PVE but want to get into PVP and be competitive. So to this I say if you’re all for this then you shouldn’t have a problem with doing the same thing in PVE. Make PVP gear scale up in PVE so that PVPers can get into PVE likewise that way both sides win.
everyone hates the rating for ilvl and honor grind. literally a system only its creator loves.
the demand for low barrier to entry has a lot of factors behind it and is very multifaced, but its because it hits so many pain points, a lot of the game right now is designed to be locked away behind pointless timegated grinds just to pad the patch out content wise. as a pvper this feels terrible, i already work to pay for the game, but now i have to work to play in game as well, i just want to log on, queue up, and pvp.
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You’ve got it wrong, we want the ilvl between pvp gear squished, so that when you buy the full honor set, you’re not 20-30 ilvls below the top level conquest set.
We do not want pve gear making its way into pvp, and we don’t want pvp gear being used in pve.
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The same could be said about PVE tho. What if I just want to log in and raid as a PVPer without spending weeks farming gear to qualify for groups? What I’m saying is if you are okay with normalizing PvP gear, then you are also for normalizing PVE gear for the same reason.
the gearing system i proposed would be insanely popular with both sides of the house as it would effectively be perfect with no RNG and no barrier to entry. and i kept the rating for ilvl part only for the PVE ilvl. this would make rated pvp the most popular method for gearing as you could get your 100% perfect stats custom build then do arena( or buy an arena carry lol) and achieve rating in order raise your PVE ilvl(without honor grinds) the official RP here is the player needs to “prove” they are worthy of taking this gear outside of the pvp world as custom gear would be highly potent in all forms of content.
would this work in PVE? well, no. it would generate a lot of QQ as a lot of people dont want to pvp for perfect BIS. however, the reason it wouldn’t work for PVE is that PVE uses a power growth based progression model, you can be a +22 capable player, but if you are in heroic dungeon blues you can not complete a +22 no matter how good you are. you could at an equivilant system that allows for custom armor, and then scale it based on M+ rating, but what about raiders? or this new raid+?
Pve has tiers of difficulty. Pvp does not.
Example: pve has normal dungeons in which fresh 60s can complete with ease. The power level of normal dungeons match up with fresh 60 gear.
In pve, as you get higher gear, you move up higher in the tiers of difficulty: normal to heroic to mythic plus.
Pvp doesn’t have this.
Pvp right now is like jumping into a mythic plus dungeon with leveling gear. The only path is to wipe over and over and over again, getting scraps of currencies, to purchase better gear.
You just can’t compare pvp to pve.
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i suppose you could use the same low barrier to entry system for PVE, the one i suggested you go to a vendor and buy a single set for gold, this set has templated stats, but scales to “the pvp ilvl” which changes over the course of a season, but is the same in all instanced pvp and warmode.
this could work in PVE if the ilvl was scaled up automatically to the difficulty of the content.
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The point I make remains the same regardless. If you want to normalize PVP to ensure a lower barrier of entry then you have to in favor for normalizing PVE For a lower barrier of entry for pvp players. If you support one being normalized then you must be in favor of normalizing the other unless you’re biased to your preferred content. If you’re not in favor of one then you shouldn’t be in favor of the other is my point.
…I mean you can already, its like not pvp gear has resil or pvp power on it anymore and the higher end gear is a good ilvl so…
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It scales up in pvp content to its true Ilvl only. A 262 in pvp is only a 262 in pvp outside of pvp it’s a 249. I’m just trying to get people to understand if you’re asking to normalize PVP to make it easier for you then you must be in favor of normalizing PVE to make it easier for pvp players. Normalize both or normalize either and grind both sides
I didn’t realize pvpers hard such a hard time in scripted content lol. I am personally in favour of not having pvp gear scale down in pve and vice versa.But I am also in favour of just having a single honour set and a single conquest set with an elite recolour, these new systems they put in place are terrible.
You are talking to a guy with a pure f2p account, I probably no more about grinding then you ever will lol.
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The game has always had this one way or another. Ever since vanilla. It is what WoW is.
Why couldn’t pve players use this arguement? Way the game has always been. I do both and it takes WAY longer to get desired gear in PvE over PvP. Took me 4 weeks to even get a weapon. Still not even close to BiS trinkets. PvE requires more “work” just because RNG. But it is the way of the game. Point of it is to grind and do content. When most are even close to best gear they move on to another toon.
If you don’t like grinding, then a rpg isn’t for you. Can try Apex or CoD.
Wouldn’t make sense for them to change the whole concept of the game because people are lazy and just want things given to them.
But there is a lot of things people overlook or just don’t remember. Right now your health drastically increases with your gear which is what makes people terrified. But your stats they actually don’t increase that much like haste and crit.
Giving you rough numbers I remember in season one of WoD my shadow priest had high 70s or low 80s of mastery. Going into season two I was over 120. That was a massive boost to damage. That wasn’t even a borrowed power in my mind blast if I got back to back procs with current PVP gear they would have less than 30% health. Two instant cast.
They have done a lot more balancing than people want to give them credit for. Secondary stats used to be out of control which was causing even worse balance in game.
As much as the gear item level increases if you actually look at Sims in a patchwork style fight the percent increase in DPS is actually pretty small. And what that actually means is you’re talking about a stationary fight with perfect circumstances where you never have to move you just concentrate 100% on your rotation.
Majority of the people who play this game do both content. A lot of people play this game because they enjoy the player progression. Trying to avoid player progression for a small minority will actually more destroy the game then trying to make it easier for people who don’t want to do other content.
You should enjoy the game as a whole if you only want to focus on one small part then enjoy what you do. But people shouldn’t be asking for easier rewards because they don’t want to do other content when in actuality I guarantee you no one actually wants to run Torg or do daily quest.
Some people actually have real lives and jobs
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There are plenty of people who have jobs, family, friends who do end game content and push rating. It’s more personal choice what you want to do.
Changing a whole game concept to make it easier for people who don’t want to put in effort isn’t what most people want.
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what effort does a rated or mythic raider put in? he sits at a chair all day and pushes buttons.
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It’s not a matter of parity ffs, what is wrong with you? Why can’t pvp just be pvp without some trash talk about effort and work?? Let their knowledge of class abilities and reflexes speak for themselves.
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So are you saying a regular dungeon is same as mythic jailer?
Rated play is the same at 1400 and 3k MMR?
Harder content is more effort.
If I remember correctly you used sports analogies before.
Would a high school baseball player be putting in the same effort as a professional? They both are doing the exact same thing but one is doing it at a harder level.
There is a drastic difference in effort people put in in a random battleground to a rated battleground. At a low MMR maybe they’re the same if everyone is doing yolo.
Just like how there would be a drastic difference between random Epic and a rated epic.
You have harder games vs premades, that is putting more effort in.
The content is already normalized for pve. Enemies will be a particular strength in LFR, then a particular but harder strength in Normal, then Heroic, then Mythic. Same goes for dungeons - Normal, Heroic, M0, and so on.
This means that if you want to beat a raid or some dungeons, there is a pve activity that matches your current power level. And beating the activity will reward you with gear that reflects the difficulty of the opponents you just faced, and the gear you get is powerful enough to let you step foot into the next higher difficulty content if you choose. Natural progression based upon both your power and that of your normalized opponents.
Pvp has none of this. Everyone is thrown together, and those without gear get annihilated. For those who simply want to do unrated pvp, it breaks all rules of pve gearing - it does not put you against similar-powered opponents based on your own power. It does not reward you based on how powerful your opponents were. The enemies can be anywhere from Normal dungeon to Mythic raid strength. And for having to face Mythic strength opponents, it rewards you LFR or Normal gear after a lengthy slog of getting deleted.
Pve is already normalized. The opponent strength is predictable and matches your own power. We want pvp to be the same. And since you can’t separate pvp in terms of player power due to too few players, then you have to normalize the player power. Give all access to the same gear within pvp.
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lol…that’s a little different than a video game.
This entire argument seems hinged on a false premise; that it’s pve players wanting a low barrier to entry. It’s not. It pvp player that either only want to do random bgs (like myself) and eventually get gear to compete effectively against anyone they may meet in a random bg, as well as people who do enjoy rated pvp but like to play a lot of alts and so don’t want to spend a bunch of time feeling like they are lvl 40 playing in the max lvl bracket.
Obviously I don’t have official number but I doubt the vast majority of pve players care at all about pvp unless they feel compelled to do it.