Minor thing, but the attack on Southshore didn’t really happen as the Forsaken wanted, since the Blight concentration was too high. They fully intended to claim the town, not ‘nuke’ it.
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That tracks, since they go in after the fact to deal with the byproducts. Not really the most sympathetic motivation, though. Particularly after the Forsaken had already dug up and trotted out the Kel’Thuzad lackey Southshore had rightly lynched so that he could go bother them, and considering that this attack was also the fate of Marshal Redpath, who they demonize and then murder a second time for supposedly “planning to attack Deathknell.”
It also suggests that Tarren Mill might in the first place have been “claimed” from the “human infestation” by the Forsaken.
He was caught spying and dealt with in the same way any other faction in this setting would deal with a hostile foreign agent.
I can point to a quest that confirms the Apothecaries were sending agents into Dun Garok to massacre and poison. Where are you getting that the Captured Mountaineer was a spy?
And not every faction in this game would execute a prisoner by way of recreational poison.
If the whole “nativist” argument is supposed to work for the free dead (like, uh… Alexi Barov and Helcular) then it works just as well for Raleigh and Marshal Redpath.
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He was captured by the Deathguard after Dun Garok was dealt with. I suppose they could’ve dragged him through the active warzone that was Silverpine but that seems like an awful lot of work to get a labrat for a junior apothecary.
And the Forsaken were right to deal with a dwarf fortress in their territory. It has an armory and tanks in it. It wasn’t a social club it was a military installation.
You poison him in Tirisfal around 15 levels before the Dun Garok quests where you kill Captain Ironhill, and Tirisfal>Silverpine>Hillsbrad form a sequence, so that can’t be right.
So it’s alright to attack standing dwarf fortresses from the Second War unprovoked. What it’s not okay to do under any circumstances is interfere with necromancers, defend your town from undead necromancers you already killed for this type of thing, or rebel against your necromancers. Is that what I’m to understand?
You know what else was a military installation and not a social club? The Apothecarium. Forsaken High Command. And from all appearances, Tarren Mill. I can’t find the same argument for Southshore and it’s not even really there for Hillsbrad Fields or Dalaran.
Oh you’re talking about Classic.
I’m referring to Cata content. I replayed Classic one time 3ish years ago. And yeah that was kinda the Forsaken’s rough draft. There were a lot of weird ideas that didn’t make it to season 2 as it were.
Yeah, it was classic that was the rough draft. That’s why the Cata version of that mountaineer quest still rewards gear that references Gallow’s End.
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I mean Gallow’s End is still there it just sucks now.
Having it just be a human tavern wasn’t the best thing in the world. But it was an interesting bit of world building that was the one normal building the Forsaken kept. It made sense from a pragmatic point of view as you’d probably want some accommodations ready for living adventurers who’d pay good money for a warm, dry bed. But also interesting as it suggested the living dead apparently still enjoy a good pub.
Replacing it with a completely stock standard cookie cutter building remains the worst thing the Forsaken have ever done. Truly indefensible and I hope the civic planners face justice.
Gallow’s End hasn’t been there since 2010. That ugly recycled WotLK building doesn’t have any such accompanying text, and I’d reject it as blasphemous tripe if it did.
Before Wrath, the only Forsaken building that wasn’t an old human structure of some kind was the Undercity, which was a Scourge base. I always thought that dichotomy was more interesting than the grape Nerds stuff.
Unfortunately I’m pretty sure it’s still called Gallow’s End.
I’m currently stuck on the Reclamation of Lordaeron quest. Ish bugged out on me. I got no followup after beating the Plague monster in Maldraxxus and doubled back to Tirisfal.
So I’ve been in and out of there a few times and I think that’s what it’s still called but I’m not 100% sure.
Either way needs a redesign. I think they could tweak the Venthyr taverns and that’d work fine. That sort of crypt club vibe is nice. Needs to be more unrefined and have a different color palette though. Also maybe they could use the stained glass we see in the windows of those seldom used Forsaken ship models we only see en masse during the Stormheim starter.
I never cared for the dedicated Forsaken architecture, personally. In my opinion the Alliance finally calling the whole “Sylvanas has bolstered her defenses within the Tirisfal Glades” bluff in the most poetic possible way is an opportunity to get back to having actual buildings with a sense of purpose - the town hall, the tavern, the stables, the smithy. In Wrath/Cata era Forsaken settlements we get mad science lab, small Monster High house, and big Monster High house.
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Yeah I think those make sense in the context of Wrath. As they were more forward operating bases than settlements. But from then on we really just have the manor model as the Forsaken’s only domestic habitat.
They’re undead not dead. You’d think they’d have taverns, shops, Forgotten Shadow churches. All spooky of course but still buildings meant for bodies to comfortably inhabit.
The only unique building in Brill, far as I can tell, is the stable. Oh how my cup runneth over.
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The coolest thing Cata Brill added bar none was the Sylvanas statue. If they’d just put that near the old well, maybe put a blight tank in the cemetery for Holland to hang out around, and left the rest the hell alone, it would’ve been perfect.
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I’m kinda hoping we’ll see a remade Lordaeron City with a lot more unique Forsaken stuff. The Capitol being just a few gazebos and a park was the most disappointing thing to me. I’d always pictured a sprawling metropolis twice the size of Stratholme with twice as many Scourge waiting in the dark behind those chained and barred gates in the courtyard. And that’s why the Forsaken weren’t using it.
I of course love the Undercity but it was a Scourge citadel they were squatting in. Wasn’t really their own thing. The Capitol reborn in their own image sounds cool.
Especially in modern WoW where the line between questing area and city can be blurred like in Dazar’Alor or Boralus. So maybe part of the Undercity is reclaimed but it’s still kinda a hot zone. Throw a dungeon and raid in there as well if you want.
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I was pretty happy with the Cata Ruins of Lordaeron. It was functional in the way Gilneas could’ve been if not for the phasing issues, and visually consistent with the courtyard. And speaking frankly, I think every inch of the place BFA touched was worse off for it, much like with Stromgarde. Just made it look like Eichenwalde.
I guess but it just made it very confusing why the Forsaken would use the Undercity.
Other than the fact it’s roughly 5x the size of the city it’s a sewer of. And yeah I get it was going to be Arthas’s throne but man. How is that the most impressive Scourge construct?
Idk if I was enslaved by the Scourge I probably wouldn’t hang out in their house unless there were no better options. So I’d just assumed Lordaeron City was a Stratholme tier zombie apocalypse that the Forsaken walled off instead of dealing with.
Like Tirisfal is cursed it’s never bright out there. No reason whatsoever not to use the service. So I guess the reasoning was Sylvanas wanting everyone to be as emo as she was. As if Sira is any indication boy do undead elves sure hate looking at trees.
And now that I wrote that, Teldrassil suddenly makes a strange amount of sense.
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I’m hoping for an old world revamp soon. Maybe they’ll update the ruins above to make it more like a city. Maybe they can make it so a lot of the Horde races other than Forsaken live up there and the Forsaken live in the sewers or something. I can’t imagine visiting UC is very pleasant for many aside from the undead, it would provide the Horde races with a bit of a more pleasant experience. ’
They should probably give the Forsaken a coastal town in Tirisfal as well, I was always curious about how they built their ships if they don’t have any docks.
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I got a cool suggestion how about the next Darnassus is just a human town, and the Nelves have a tree house way, way up in the branches. Where nobody has to look at the tree humping moon freaks.
Do you see how you sound?
Boat necromancy.
That isn’t a joke that’s the lore. They raise sunken ships and, spookify them I guess. The actual process of this is never shown or explained but it would suggest Forsaken warships are fullly capable of;
Which would also be cool to see.
I wouldn’t hold my breath though. Until there’s a new territory that requires a boat to travel betwixt it’s probably zeppelins from now until the end of time. But a dock on Tirisfal’s northern shore sounds cool.
I see no reason why one doesn’t exist. It’s bay area real estate and is only inhabited by murlocs.
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I wasn’t trying to be smart, I was trying to come up with an actual suggestion. I’m just saying for the other races, living/visiting underground scourge ruins/sewers doesn’t sound a good time. It’d be a way for the ruins up top to be used and the Forsaken still use the Undercity.
Ahh, okay. I do remember that now that you mention it. It’d still make sense for them to have at least one port though to dock and such for troops, supplies, etc.