I’ll be arcane for life. Have pretty much been since the burning crusade.
Just me, but it bugs me that we have so many spell modifiers. Getting rid of Rune of Power was great, but incanters should also go.
Just give us consistent damage, with our major cool downs giving us that hurrah feel.
At any rate, as long as our three main arcane spells feel good, like blast, missile and barrage, I’ll be happy.
I’m curious what you think, now that arcane has fallen to near the bottom of the heap on every website (including warcraftlogs)
This week we have Frost mage at #9 in overall damage, Fire mage at 11, and Arcane at 19
What I think now that arcane has undergone a ton of nerfs?
Frost is still at C tier according to mythicstats (the website you I am assuming are citing) it was at before the rework which I guess was successful in that it didn’t move the bar. Its still doing terrible in raids. Its debatable for pvp, just saw someone say it was s in pvp which was then disputed by another person but whatever lets assume it was right.
So yea frosts probably the only spec for mage. Its middling for raiding fine for m+ and good for pvp.
But if you are asking me this as some kinda glib thing like SEE I WAS RIGHT like no you weren’t because again, arcane has undergone a ton of nerfs since your original claim. Even fire was nerfed. The only spec that wasn’t nerfed was frost and the only thing to be said is that its rotation sucks.
They let Arcane fall low enough that it was obvious to me that it would not be a meta spec this season despite starting out that way. Blizzard’s top people have often said that they respect player time, so it is only natural to realize that they were shifting the class to use Frost in M+
You’re grasping at straws a bit with the repeated nerfs. There were buffs that were then essentially reverted with the aura nerfs, and then one hero talent was buffed when the other was nerfed ultimately. It’s about a 1% nerf since we last talked.
You’re not looking at raider IO I guess – “fine” is a bit of an understatement for frost in M+ considering it’s been used to time the top the 5th and 11th best runs currently. It is the first spect to show up that isn’t enh/dk/aug, beating out assa
Had an arcane sunfury mage in a heroic dungeon earlier with relatively better gear than me. Needless to say i overtook them on every boss pull and i just dinged 80 yesterday and working on gear.
Why am i saying this? Because arcane from my perspective is underperforming. I remember arcane being dominant on charts at the beginning of TWW. looks like arcane got the nerf bat pretty hard.
Maybe the one that is not looking at raider io is you. Mages are on the top runs just for utility, but if you take a look at the dmg metrics on raider io you will see that mages are not doing ok at all
At peak performance, this past week Frost mage had the #5 best run in regards to overall dps (Semage obviously)
#1 and #2 were BOTH shaman – Enh at the top, Ele will be nerfed next week.
The specs that beat frost (1.7M) in raw damage were Assa (1.8M) and Unholy DK (1.7m)
That is just a hair off from Frost. Frost is pumping! It beats Frost DK and Balance which are both more ‘meta’ right now. But this is in the hands of the best players in the game, you’re probably right that the average frost mage is not doing so well in keys.
In order to say that you need a bigger sample than jus one.
You need to actually looks at the average of the statistic, not the top
That’s not how M+ works. If one person can time a 17, then other people can too.
The community copies that person and then 2 weeks later everyone else is using their build, or that comp.
Aside, this ignores the fact that:
Utility IS a part of M+ and it IS super important. That it is also possible to do top-tier damage as frost, and it brings the utility, is ideal for keys.
Finally what you’re also not talking about is the damage profile. The overall damage is not what times bigger keys – it is a combination of prio damage and overall damage. If everyone does even AoE then you will always have one mob in the pack that dies much later than the others, which greatly slows the key down.
This is what makes enhance so good, it has really good prio. This is also what made spriest so good for so long, it has basically the best damage profile in the game.
Mages all have a good damage profile vs ret, for example. This is why rets won’t show up in the top keys – there just isn’t much workable prio (without sacrificing a ton of AoE)
You are 100% right, on premades, wich is the minority of the population.
If blizzar want to tune theyr game just for the top 5% that is ok. It is theyr choice.
Also, comp have alot to do on those realy high keys, so if a mage is able to time it it doesnt mean other mage with the same skill will be able to do it, if it is playing a diferent comp
Sure, but that a frost mage is included in the comp says a lot. And that team doesn’t seem like they are slowing down.
Finally, the top runs has a huge influence on the rest of the game. For example fire mage was way worse than all 3 hunter specs on lower keys in dragonflight but people still picked the mages in group finder because that’s what they see the Echo and Liquid players playing…
So I would argue tuning for the top end does have a very large influence on people who pug a lot, like me.
You necrod this thread after a month to fail to make a point and after being repudiated failed to make a point again. Congratulations.
Looks like you’ve run out of actual substance to debate about and only have personal insults left. Nothing has been repudiated. Some others have made fair points, and I wasn’t right about everything, but in regards to the points you’ve brought up, nothing has been compelling
You are arguing that using changed data you were correct. If you still can’t see how stupid that is I pray that you never drive nor look up while its raining.
It is about a 1% nerf, as discussed before. Spymaster’s web by itself is a 3.5% increase from the next best trinket.
And my original point is that Arcane was nerfed into the ground BEFORE my OP. That continues to be true. As of this moment Arcane is ranked at 22/26 on mythicstats for overall damage. At least we’re beating Aug again
But keep making up stories and using personal insults, you obviously don’t have a point to make anymore.
Arcane isn’t as bad as you’re claiming, atm…
What objective evidence do you have to back that up?
Playing the game and not letting the doom and gloom take over.
I’m not talking about whether Arcane is viable or not in keys, or that you can or can’t have fun. If I weren’t having fun I would have jumped ship long ago. This is an academic discussion of the meta.
They gutted the crap out of us and all these posers are putting up weak arguments trying to deny it because they like the idea of mage suffering. For whatever reason us and pallies always seem to be hated the most. Whatever, far from the first season ive had to brute force high end content through shear bloody will.