FPS Stability/Performance in Nerub'ar Palace

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So, I know there’s ~10 threads already regarding general performance, but they’re all staggeringly lacking in information. I’m going to post my entire specs, and general feedback from my guild’s core raid, contrast it with other TWW gameplay performance, and then with Dragonflight, to better frame it for some people.

Let me start with: I don’t have any performance issues anywhere else, really. At least none that stand out as far as WoW is concerned. I’ve always anticipated frame drops when zoning in and out of places with large populations, or a lot of objects/physics/NPCs.

Dxdiag: https://pastebin.com/JyBRuDPy

Specs (for those that only want a cursory look):
OS: Windows 10 IoT LTSC 2021, 22H2 (up to KB5041582)
-Notables: Copilot & Edge additionally removed. O&OSU is run, and unneeded services are disabled. Super Admin is used (relevant later). Exploit protections all disabled.
SAM is enabled, and only Anti-Lag 2 is used through the driver at the moment. Hard limiting FPS to 120 for ambient temperature reasons, otherwise I can uncap to 240 if I want, but it’s not easy to hit in anything more than 5 man or open world stuff.

MOBO: ASrock X670E Steel Legend
CPU: 7800X3D (AIO’d)
GPU: 7900 XT (Sapphire Pulse, repasted with PTM 7950) 24.20.01.02 driver (AFMF2 Preview) – Confirmed Message Based-Interrupts.
RAM: Corsair Vengeance, CL30, FWL 10 NS, 32 gigs @ 6000 Mhz (EXPO/XMP)
Storage: Dual Samsung 990 Pro 2 TB (updated firmware). OS and WoW are separate drives.

While running Nerub’ar Palace in a 30 man, performance was… questionable. I’d already updated addons and Weakauras, and purged or disabled broken/pending updated ones. I’ve used Warmup and Addon Usage for benching and diagnosing issues in the past.

Advanced Combat Logging Enabled, and Details Interval are default.

Other notable in-game settings (high/max on most):
CMAA 2 - 8x/8x
Ray Tracing - Off
Liquid Detail - Fair (or Low)
View Distance, Environmental Detail, Ground Clutter - 4
All 5 Compatibility Settings enabled. GPU is set, specifically.
Audio - Reverb disabled, Distance filtering enabled, 128 mb cache, Audio Channels 84 (don’t think this matters over the default limit).

IPv6 enabled (issues loading some areas in the past enabled, even with PreloadCriticalNonCritical 0. Seems fixed nowadays.

I’ve sinced dropped settings lower across the board to deal with some of the heavier frame drops. Some boss abilities absolutely crush FPS in Nerub’ar Palace, and since we were last progging heroic Queen Ansurek with 29 on Wednesday, her Liquefy overlap (with the Acid drops) could bring me to 20-24 FPS, and a lot of others with weaker PCs into the single digits. Most fights I’d be averaging 54 FPS.

Everywhere else–dungeons, open world, delves–I haven’t had any issues. I know that going over 20 people places a massive additional performance burden, but this rubs me the wrong way. I was doing Mythic Nymue with 70-90 FPS stable while recording at higher settings, and just ran through Amirdrassil FAR better (though with Liquid Detail and View Distance turned down for Tindral) on average. I think Nerub’ar could stand to get some optimizations, and I know some people claim that there’s memory leak issues. I haven’t encountered this, my performance in Dornogal is much better than it was in Valdrakken, though the latter had such an open view, and it was more condensed around the fountain hub. I don’t know much about addons, but I’ve seen it said that they run on the same cores/threads as WoW, so that’s why there can be a such a performance penalty with some of them.

With the dozen threads on issues in the raid, I’m not surprised. While I could stand to have a stronger GPU, like a 4080S, I feel like this is vastly on the CPU-side. My GPU only gets buried with usage using RT or super resolution.

Thoughts?

Edit: I forgot to record Mythic Sikran, where I didn’t have any real framerate issues, but here’s Mythic: Bloodbound Horror from the week before (Week 2). Dropping this in from my post below for people to see. FPS counter thing is perma-fixed for future recordings, but we’re working on Ovi’nax next week. I’ll try to record some footage for performance’s sake, including my in-game settings, so other players can compare.

Update with the Mythic: Broodtwister Ovi’nax progression FPS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIr-wJuQgSY

This covers our four best pulls. Details was around 0.5s intervals, Advanced Combat Logging (NOT live logging, though). My in-game settings for the fight are in the opening (Graphics, Audio, Network). Sorry for the stilted voiceover; I was trying to multitask. lol

Our MTs were virtually freezing when the adds came out. Not logging, no details/max interval, disabled add HP bars, etc. One of the tanks had upscaling enabled, which was helping murder his FPS–shoutout to Blizzard for ignoring this since 10.2.

Edit 10/6/24: I’m aware of the WeakAura ‘Model’ performance issue. I, however, have not been using any of these, so this isn’t tied to my performance experiences in TWW at all. It may be causing issues for others, though.

Edit: 10/25/24: Forgot to upload our actual Mythic: Broodtwister kill last week. Here that is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dbt0wzRrnY

Dropping the Plater update interval to 1s (max) helped a bit. More than messing with Details, at least.

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Played on 30 mans, got around 35-40-50 frames. It’s playable, but I agree that the performance in this raid should be better.

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Like any software, you need to run it in the base/unmodified state for testing data to truly be useful.

Even changing the frequency that certain addons (like Details) collect data can have significant impacts on performance (looking at you, Mythic Anduin).

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With the baseline testing being without any addons, I think this point is generally irrelevant for most people. For me, it’s another option to tick settings down to try and hit reasonable average framerates, but it won’t stop the hitches of certain abilities.

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it’s been 5+ posts and more than 50 people reported on this, something is off and it’s on Blizz’s end at this point.

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Yeah, I’m saying that your testing doesn’t tell you much since you’re still running addons.

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That’s, unfortunately, the standard for anything but newbies. Maybe on our second clear of Heroic I can try to wing it with nothing, but that’s a big ask when this is the pretense for group progression content.

But since you mentioned in the first place, it sounds like you doubt all of the people on the forums claiming to have attempted playing on a fresh install with nothing. I had to do that back in Dragonflight to fix a strange freeze I had in BGs, though it didn’t really help my overall framerate. I ended up just rebuilding my PC then. As far as TWW goes, only Nerub’ar Palace has some overbearing performance issues. I actually run pretty great in Dornogal, all this considered.

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Maybe that was your takeaway, but I’m talking about how to perform effective troubleshooting in this thread specifically. Every patch and expansion comes with players reporting problems on the forum, but 50 replies about a topic is a raindrop in the ocean compared to widespread issues that occurred in the past.

When it comes to pinning down game performance issues, Blizzard holds no responsibility for how addons affect your gameplay. Additionally, “updated addons” can mean anything. Simply pushing one small code change will flag the addon as “updated,” and there are no compatibility tests performed on the code by Blizzard.

So if you’re using them and reporting a problem, how would Blizzard be able to determine the problem is their game?

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You’re kinda right, though I’m not suffering anywhere near what other players do. I’m offering information more than anything, while sharing the common problem. We’ve dropped to 22 (from 29) for heroic Ansurek prog on an off night, and I’ve ticked Details intervals down to 0.50, and Shadows to Ultra.

I doubt the latter two things did anything, but we know player scaling is brutal for performance in any situation.

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Probably because you have a lot of system resources available.

None of this is to say that I don’t believe problems are happening, but that’s usually what people assume I’m saying. :smiley: I’m also experiencing some of these.

Bloodbound Horror is pretty spicy on RAM usage for me, and my guild had to taper down to 24 for Heroic Queen.

Since the technical support forum is for player-to-player troubleshooting, I included these issues in a bug report via the in-game support menu. It’s also ok to report them in the Bug Report forum.

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I recorded our Mythic kill at around 90+ FPS average, but this fight was never that bad for me. I have a lot more problems with Ovi’nax and Queen Ansurek for average frames, even with ticked down settings.

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this…its clearly on blizzards end way way WAY to many people are effect other wise

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Definitely, but it doesn’t help that dozens of people posting don’t list their specs or configuration, so most of these threads don’t have much useful information. The difference between a properly setup Windows 10 and 11 is staggering for AMD in particular. On top of that, a lot of people are running on some very weak CPUs (as the GPU requirements of WoW aren’t that high). It further isn’t helped that it’s unknown just how many 13th/14th gen Intel CPUs were damaged in the last year from their power/thermal design issues.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=B5S4SH6A70Y

(Mythic: Bloodbound Horror, my POV). Hard locked 20 people for Mythic, and you can see my FPS counter at the bottom, somewhat hidden by my menu bar. I have the CVAR to move that, but it never seems to stick. You can still read my FPS jumping up and down from 60-110. Highly playable 1440p, but I’m down to mid-ish graphics here, and this isn’t even a problem fight as far as performance.

This was recorded native 1440p with AMD HEVC at CBR 25000 kbps., and audio 256 kbps. In hindsight, I should’ve used AV1 here, since that’s what I encode in.

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I came across this thread by Google searching regarding problems with severe lag in the new Nerub’ar Palace raid and wanted to share my findings in case it’s helpful to anyone.

After running LFR to test performance while using various addon configurations I found the primary culprit for the lag in my case. For me the issue was primarily the Details addon followed by Ace3 Library second.

Once I disabled Details in particular I saw a massive performance boost and disabling Ace3 improved it just a bit further. I went from running all minimum settings and nearly crashing due to the severe lag to now being able to play with nearly maxed out settings on a 20-25 player setting.

This fix may not be the same or work for everyone depending what kind of addons you’re using, but for anyone else experiencing lag issues as well I would suggest trying to disable Details entirely (or any other similar addon) and see if this helps you.

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Unfortunately, turning off Details isn’t a universal fix, as I have guildies that stopped using it (and Advanced Combat Logging), and Queen Ansurek is still rough in our farm. I don’t know if anyone in our roster uses Ace3 Library, so the only other addon I’ve seen that destroys performance is Narcissus (another one that I don’t know anyone who uses it).

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This is such a ridiculous statement and yet so commonly used. If an addon was causing the issue, it would be OBVIOUS.

Details refresh rate problems would act differently. Details wouldn’t suddenly get overloaded with input when a boss uses an ability with a big animation, especially when many abilities don’t immediately do damage/healing to even generate input when they are casted.

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Sounds like something the developer of Details would say.

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Wow, helpful!

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I ran the WeakAuras profiler last night during Mythic, but nothing stood out. Likewise, knocking Details update intervals down didn’t seem to dent the FPS, but 1% lows are what’s important anyway. Guildies that have disabled logging or set the max interval of 3s doesn’t seem to be helping some of them.

I didn’t record our Rasha’nan rekill, but I rarely dropped under 60 FPS, save for a couple of mechanics. We’re beginning Broodtwister Ovi’nax prog tonight, so I’ll record some of that for posterity, and we’ll see how badly that goes. I’ve fixed my FPS counter visibility, and I’ll probably have it uploaded by Thursday or Friday night, so I can edit it into this thread.

Edit: Mythic Broodtwister Ovi’nax performance and in-game settings added to the original post.

Edit 2: I’m aware of the WeakAura ‘Model’ performance issue. I, however, have not been using any of these, so this isn’t tied to my performance experiences in TWW at all. It may be causing issues for others, though.

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