It’s worded weirdly. I think he means his post was agreeing about Calia being a good leader, which you replied to in disagreement. Though I read it like you did at first, but given the context makes zero sense.
It definitely reads a bit weirdly, hoping I understood it properly otherwise I’m even more confused.
The way I saw it is that he took my disaproval of Calia as an implicit support of Sylvanas.
Maybe because I’m used to seeing that happening… apparently one can’t dislike both equally and opposing one, means supporting the other, when it’s not like that at all.
You misunderstand, I’m saying you replied to my post about me agreeing with someone that Calia would make a fine leader.
So far, according to you, Calia’s crimes include abandoning her people and being different from them. Sylvanas’s crimes include manipulating the Forsaken for at least the past decade for her own selfish gain, continuing manufacture and use of the Blight against orders, brainwashing attempted or successful, abducting allies, manipulating the Horde as Warchief for her own selfish gain as soon as she was appointed, starting the Fourth War for her own selfish gain, abandoning her people, betraying not only her people but all of the Horde, and damning all souls across the universe to the Maw. And that’s just off the top of my head.
Sylvanas is absolutely worse than Calia, morally and as a leader.
Edit: You’re right, it’s not like that. I’ve never once said that you can’t dislike both and I’ve agreed with that. I think the communication broke down at:
You seem to have taken that as me saying “Calia is a better representation of the Forsaken than Sylvanas was” even though I was replying to your post that mentioned leadership.
It’s ironic that you say that because I’ve agreed with you several times and said that we share the opinion that Forsaken should lead Forsaken.
I, too, fondly remember when Putress appeared at the Wrathgate and said “DID YOU THINK WE HAD FORGOTTEN? DID YOU THINK WE HAD FORGIVEN?! Yes, actually. Have a nice day.”
Truly an unforgettable moment.
A different flavor of bad is still bad.
Calia needs to go.
Agreed. /10
I was doing some shower thinking, as one does, and came up with something.
The only scenario where her presence would have worked would have been if she had been killed in the ditch she initially hid at, while her people were getting massacred to be raised as undead just like everyone else.
Upon regaining free will because of Sylvanas, she could have broke off from the bulk of Forsaken, perhaps in shame over her death while everyone else died defending Lordaeron, maybe even a few knowing that she “made it” so to speak. The rumors gradually spreading under wraps, and finally coming to their realization when Sylvanas started showing up her changing behavior.
Yada yada, “The Horde is nothing!” and all that, the Forsaken would have ended with a leader that actually fought for them, dealt with their same plight and shown to care for them.
As she is now, she is a mistake.
That’s kind of my stance with her. She seems haphazardly pushed into the limelight, but they haven’t done anything to help build her up as a leader for the Forsaken. She hasn’t helped any out of dire straits, she wasn’t there to really support those against sylvanas, she just hasn’t been around. As it stands, I’m not sure what about her is supposed to make her a compelling leader for them
All she’s done so far, is comforting the undead Night Elves after trying to pull a “How do you do, fellow kids?” with the rest of the Forsaken and them somehow drinking that up (at least for the most part it seems) when it would make sense for them to detest the Menethil bloodline at this point.
As it is, she’s only an Alliance sympathizing figurehead and another example of the Human Potential™ infecting everything.
My 2 cents:
We’re dead because Arthas killed us.
We’re undead because Arthas raised us.
We wouldn’t accept him as a king. We wouldn’t even accept him as a criminal. We would only accept him as a target, and then only very, very briefly. As far as the Forsaken are concerned, Arthas is responsible for every second of misery they must endure until time ends. And they’d love nothing more than to make sure he gets a hundred-fold helping of misery himself.
I’m kind of an odd ball, since for gameplay reasons I really want the faction war to end at this point. I want to be able to play with friends on the other side on races and characters I’m already invested in. I don’t mind perse if the story evolves to match that.
However, I do think the leaders should represent the ideals of that particular race. And animosity wouldn’t realistically disappear over night. The Forsaken leader(s) should be Forsaken first and foremost. The leadership should be focused on their people first, then their allies.
Calia feels forced since she hasn’t been with the Forsaken or done much of anything for them. Stuff like that definitely makes things feel out of place for the Forsaken, as it can spread to other aspects of the lore / game.
For instance, if they ever were to remove the faction restriction, it would feel very jarring if everything over the course of a single expansion became buddy buddy. No! Orcs and Humans have a natural mistrust of one another due to their history. But they have been shown to be capable of working together too. It would be far more compelling if they were to go through that process rather than us starting at point A and randomly jumping to point D, skipping points B and C.
Edit: Just wanted to mention, I know that’s really ironic considering I have my Horde centric transmog on and ai have deep faction pride. I have a Horde flag on my wall ahaha.
Natalie Seline wasn’t truly alive during Legion. We just asked her spirit to get her butt out of the grave and help us
That’s not to say Seline should have stayed in the Cult
Would I accept Arthas as my King? Let me put it this way: Back when I had a pulse, before I took this name, I was the Lady’s Man of Lorderon, 6’4", 270 lbs of muscle, long blond hair, strong jaw, abs of steel, and a butt you could bounce silver pieces off of. There wasn’t a maiden in the entire Eastern Kingdoms who didn’t want to scream my name! Now look at me, I look like rotted meat, my hair’s gone, my jaw’s stapled on, my abs are gone as is the stomach behind them, and my johnson fell off three years ago and was grabbed by a sewer rat! And who do I have to thank for this? Arthas freaking Menethil! So when you ask if I’d accept that miserable !@#$#$@$!@!$% as my King the only thing I have to say is HELL !@$&$%^# NO!!!
Sorry for the delay, I wasted far too long making this thing:
Personally, I’m all for the faction divide. I’m not against some restrictions being lifted to facilitate gameplay but, I like the factions being distinct, with their own themes and aesthetics.
Calia not only ruins the Forsaken narrative, she also tramples over everything I like.
But she wasn’t dead either.
No, you’re fine. Forums are set up in a way where I really don’t mind waiting a bit between replies :P. Plus that meme is worth the wait ahaha.
That’s fair. I still definitely want there to be Horde and Alliance. The two are meant to be distinct from one another, and they represent different sorts of ideals.
Then again, I also think all classes should be open to all races too. So I understand that I have a number of out there opinions xD.
As for Calia, yeah. They needed to cook / bake that idea of her a bit more before bringing it her out to try and replace Sylvanas. There’s just not enough going on there for it to make sense. Her only claim is she used to be royalty there. But that lineage and the whole kingdom ended with Arthas, and it seems strange for Forsaken to not be immediately wary of her at the very least.
On one hand, he was the crown prince of my lands when I was alive - on the other hand, he killed the King…so, no. No regicidal maniacs on my throne, thank you very much.
“NO!!! I would BURN HIM WHERE HE STANDS!!! I will NEVER accept that DEVIL as my King. He is NOTHING to me.”
The forsaken should be lead by forsaken, Voss, maybe even alonsus.
Why?
Again, why? Just because they’re a name recognition?
Her condition seems to be reminiscent of the Forsakens’ , although please correct me if I’m wrong. I just wish they didn’t portray her as a literal living human.