Missing Brill too, but I’m not holding my breath. I’ll continue to check in on Sylvanas and her development, but that’s about it.
Not fun… I mean Sylvanas was everything for us and now its just so weird. I dont even know what to say
im more or less praying sylvanas is out of the way by the end of this, whether or undead or dead dead, so that the forsaken actually can develop outside of her shadow.
this faction has mostly been decided by sylvanas as a character. which makes a semblance of sense, i suppose, since she’s been an absolute monarch dating back to its inception. but… the forsaken are a people. a people with history longer than they’ve been forsaken. people have culture and choices outside of a dictator’s whims.
while its an absolute stupid, inane, impossible dream that there’s gonna be any worldbuilding in this setting for an essential populace… that’s what dreams’re for.
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To answer op: bad to the point I quit for the first time in a decade lol
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Yah, it’s very obvious it’s fake.
I feel for the Forsaken players that had their character closely tied to Sylvannas and then we gets this story that back tracks on all the aspects people liked about the character. It also sucks because BfA and even Shadowlands has so much good cosmetics for Forsaken players. Every now and then I see some one run past me on my Draenei and I’m like awww they look so cool, I want to race change back to one!!!
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Pride is overrated…
(Edit: also–I have been LOVING rping as a Forsaken in Post-BFA/Shadowlands; have especially been enjoying the [N-RP] Cleansing the Blight | Tue 11/30 5:30 PM | Legion Dalaran: The Portrait Room series in addition to a number of smaller offshoots).
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So, this might seem like an odd opinion here.
But I actually think an expansion where the Forsaken are the ones fighting a defensive battle against a revanchist Alliance (albiet primarily humans and worgen) would be a good thing for the Forsaken.
Less for the “Grr, war!” portion of things and more having the Forsaken get put in a spot where they ned to figure out who they’re going to be (i.e, follow a different path or revert to the monsters they had been under Sylvanas) as combatting the consequences of a decade of constant aggression against their living neighbor.
Basis of this isn’t for Forsaken to simply get punked though. It would be to be the foundation for what I’d call the ‘Part 2’ of their civilization shifting into something more than being the Banshee’s weapon. The Forsaken making decisive appeals to show that even if monstrous, they’re more than just that and that they deserve the chance to have a new future (and that they’ll fight tooth and nail for it, even without Sylvanas)
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Honestly, the last several faction wars have done pretty severe damage to the Forsaken identity. They’ve spent too much time marching to far off locations and exterminating the native populations to engender a whole lot of sympathy as a rightful nation defending their homeland. The inability of Blizzard to decide whether they wanted them to be the Scourge 2.0 or something different led to the narrative dissonance of their actions being Scourge while the audience is blatantly lied to about them being something different.
I don’t think another faction war, even a defensive faction war, and especially not one written by Blizzard, is ever going to fix the problems they’ve baked into the Forsaken story, so they should just avoid it as much as they can, and prove that they’re different without making it dependent on some Alliance story.
This is unrealistic in terms of scope and I know that many people probably have other preferences for a Forsaken heritage quest, but my preference would be that the Forsaken Heritage quest revolves around the refounding of Alterac as an allied republic or kingdom. If the Forsaken are to be the heirs of Lordaeron, then they should take an interest in the fate of its old allies, especially the allies that the Alliance has forgotten about.
Notably, it should not involve blight it down and raise em all, but demonstrate that the Forsaken are capable of existing in a positive manner with their living neighbors, and that there are living neighbors who might prefer the dead Forsaken to the living Alliance.
This would involve probably turning Alterac back into a zone and expanding it, similar to the warfront remakes from BfA. There would be a questline around gaining the trust and building up the forces of a cadre of Alterac patriots and supplying/building/backing up their efforts to re-establish their nation from the cabal of Scourge Remnants/Ogre Cultists/Syndicate Bandits that currently rule it. Possibly Sylvanas loyalists could be narratively dunked on here too. Alternatively, the Syndicate could be re-contextualized to be capable of reforming itself to not be that bad, and show that story instead.
If an Alliance antagonist has to be included, it should be some Stromgarde meddlers - it was Strom that destroyed Alterac in the first place, and a newly rising Strom that has the most to be worried about of a Forsaken-aligned Alterac to their north.
Maybe this is sounding too much like an Alterac Allied Race questline, which I would not be opposed to if Blizzard removes or severely weakens the faction barrier, but I very much like the idea of defining the Forsaken as the heirs of Lordaeron by making them at least able to act in the best ideals of the old Alliance of Lordaeron and correct its failings. The old Alliance allowed Strom to punitively destroy Alterac, but the Forsaken are willing to make it right when the new Alliance aren’t interested.
We need more Ghostlands, and less Gilneas and Darkshore. Just because a state can fight tooth, nail, and blight doesn’t mean it deserves third, fourth and fifth chances - Blizzard needs to show that reason in some other way, and I think Alterac provides a pretty golden opportunity.
TL;DR help i cant stop typing
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This is Blizzard we’re talking about here.
No more faction war please and put Forsaken back in the lore hole (or lore grave?) where it’s safe from the bad writing.
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Maybe it’s because I started with Vanilla and skipped Cata, MOP and WOD, but I’ve never (and still don’t) appreciate peoples’ problem with the BFA direction for Sylvanas and the Forsaken. It all felt very consistent with their initial inception and direction (just take a look at the Vanilla/Classic Prologue, or the original devs’ stated reason for including the Forsaken–i.e. as evil badass zombies–essentially scourge 2.0).
It helps that I LOVED the BFA story (more than any before or after), but still, nothing about it felt especially poor in terms of the writing or narrative support (that’s NOT true, of course, with regard to the Shadowlands explanation for BFA, which, in my view, cheapened the horror and blunted the nihilism of the violence…but what can you do).
I actually see this as a good opportunity for Forsaken RPers despite the circumstances. There’s a certain freedom at least when Blizz decides to run your favorite race into the dirt, leaving it a thematic mess and without a definitive leader or story about what happens after (as an orc player, I sorta get it).
This could actually be a good moment for Forsaken RPers to rally together and build a community and/or fanon that they can mostly agree on. It means you Forsaken RPers can actually help work on a community-led RP initiative if y’all band together. Without a clear direction forward from Blizzard, just take the bits and pieces of Forsaken lore and themes you like and build on those.
If Blizz doesn’t provide you with a foundation to work with for RP - create your own.
Flippant tone aside, there’s a lot of truth here.
However, we Forsaken were always of the dirt. It is where we began and it is where we belong. The notion that we were ever intended to be otherwise was the error, not BFA. BFA was our awaited time…and it was every bit as glorious as I could have hoped…(until Shadowlands…but honestly, that was not unexpected, so, we’ll see how it goes).
The punishment for being a Forsaken and supporting total peace in the story is to have the Forsaken storywise get put in the same role that Night Elves and Trolls have had since Cataclysm.
Might you be willing to say more about this? Sounds like an interesting point that you’re making but I’m not sure that I have sufficient context to follow your argument.
Functionally, Trolls and Night Elves lore wise since Cataclysm have been only given new content if they’re going to get punched down hard so another group can feel nice.
Garrosh punking Night Elves
War of Thorns
the Cata .1 expansion where Zul did a dumb
8.1 where all the build up with the Zandalari was literally to let the Alliance feel cool while Zanda players get nothing for it. (Not even a dead Jaina or Gelbin.)
Short of each expansion since Cata leading up to those two having some ‘bitter loser syndrome’ an rebounding to clap back, it’s not been a fun thing to be if one of these two are your favored group. Orcs and Forsaken have lost in the end, but they are least have been given the ability to feel strong.
Thank you! That helps a lot!
So, I guess I don’t necessarily understand why it’s so important to always play a race that feels “proud” or “justified,” or “strong” or “heroic.”
I mean, WoW’s got a lot of options for that in any given expansion cycle if that’s absolutely necessary to you, but I’d say there is a great deal more value in exploring other more challenging aspects of our shared existence.
As you’ve said, there are other races that will allow you to feel “nice” if that’s a requirement of your rp. I just don’t know why it should have to be.
The issue with that logic is that, quite frankly, it should not come to that for other groups to get to feel nice when they play their preferred race/class.
As nice as getting to enjoy the more peaceful and positive aspects of it all is, if the precedent set has been “You’re getting this before we punch you about fifty times.” it’s shifts to the mindset of “I think the other guy who hasn’t taken as many story lumps since Cata should take the hits instead.”
The other thing is, for the mentioned groups. Short of Orgrimmar and Stormwind suffering a total and utter collapse in the manner that the Forsaken got stuck with at the end of BfA, some losses they don’t get to successfully avenge isn’t going to do to diminish them, while it would do a good deal to let those who deal those losses overall feel better.
So, if I’m following you correctly, this is about equity in the type of attention received or lack thereof between races? I guess I don’t understand why it is necessary for any race to “feel better.”
Because constantly having the phrase ‘punching bag’ hanged over the group is not a pleasant thing to have on an RP server.
Yes, it’s very common and I’ve seen it present in both factions.