That is two separate issues, everyone is in the same boat with the low honor gains, you are not at any disadvantage there. Que times on Horde is terrible, this was being predicted over 6 months ago yet here we are “surprised” by it.
I don’t understand how people will fall behind for arena’s when everybody is getting the same amount of honor. The only way somebody will fall behind is if they play less than the next person. Every Horde has the same que and every Horde has the same honor gains. You only fall behind when you put in less time.
I watched my son do arena’s this week with his friend, BM hunter and Disc priest. terrible comp for arena’s. Neither of them had a single piece of PvP gear on. they went 7-3. Right now the gear does not make or break the game, a few months from now it could be a different story.
I agree the honor should be adjusted to make the gear easier to get, but the reason for this is not because you cannot be competitive without it.
I’m not surprised by the queue. It’s things like nerfing flag caps right away or the excessive nerf to high honor during day 1 of prepatch then ignoring many many forums posts about honor after that surprises me.
Queues were short and people were happy as can be, the pvp scene was the best I’ve seen in years for the short hour I was on before honor was nerfed.
Alliance have much faster queues so they will be gaining more honor than horde. Anyone who was on long enough to farm 75k honor day 1 of prepatch is also far ahead on gear now.
IF you have less gear in arena, you will lose more matches. Losing more matches will provide a lower rating. Lower rating provides less arena pts. Less arena pts is equal to less gear. Less gear means lower ratng.
It’s a never ending cycle of falling further behind people who had a gear advantage at the start. There will be people who do arena from day1 that won’t see full gear this season. This puts them at a disadvantage at the start of the next season and so starts the cycle again.
i adjusted your math a bit to account for current Q times, and realized my normal 20 hours a week will get me full honor gear in about 6 months. yikes.
You are talking about a huge minority that maxed out on honor. Everyone else is on the same boat.
You will not fall behind because of que times, all horde have the same que times.
You will not fall behind because honor gains seem to be low, they are low for Horde and Alliance.
The only way you will fall behind is by not putting in as much time as the person next to you.
If honor gains were increased by 1000% and you played 2 hours a night doing PvP, anyone that plays longer than 2 hours will pull ahead of you.
None of what you are saying is created by que times or low gains as everybody has that to deal with.
Going 7-3 starting from 0 rating I don’t think is the best example of trying to show you can be competitive. But your 2nd point is correct, and that’s the whole argument. No one is asking for the gear to be free or given to them, the grind just needs to be made manageable.
OPs numbers I’ve found to be pretty accurate with my personal honor grind which has made getting a blue set of starter gear nearly insurmountable. It’s essentially killed my motivation to play TBC unfortunately, and I’m not the only one. This is contributing to less Alliance queueing and queue times being even worse for the Horde. Sure the queue is very short, but how much better is the experience really when you are losing 4 out of every 5 bgs or sometimes worse? And then you look at honor rates required for the gear, how bad the experience is when you’re losing over and over, and people just immediately consider it not worth it and wont even queue anymore. Everyone I know either farmed all their honor in prepatch, or tried it now for a short time and just gave up due to how long it takes. Thats bad for everyone in the game, both Horde and Ally.
I think if you are expecting a full BG set this season but expect Blizzard to expedite the process for you - you are taking a bad bet.
Since we have full knowledge of how the game plays out - maybe banking honor and marks for Season 2 will leave you in a position that a lot of players that banked their honor in pre patch are in now.
right and arenas are really competitive right now?
Thats my point people are saying they cannot play arenas because they don’t have full PvP sets already. Maybe the top 5%? could be classed as competitive but the rest is not. Poor comps and PvE gear is very viable right now to start earning rating and arena points while you continue to farm your other gear.
If honor gains were increased by %1000, I’d have all my honor gear in a week or two and meet everyone who played more than me at the same gear point but within a reasonable amount of time.
Alliance are earning roughly 3x more honor than horde right now.
That “huge minority” probably more people than you realize, is putting the majority at a disadvantage.
Just finding arena partners is difficult because of how the community values the game now.
If you don’t have an armory to link to with 2200+ rating in Retail a lot of players want nothing to do with you.
If you aren’t the right class, the rest want nothing to do with you.
I think this has turned the more casual playerbase off from arenas altogether.
The PvP community destroys itself.
Perhaps Alliance are coming to this realization faster than Horde because of the queues, though. Hard to say. It will be interesting to see how it plays out.
The math in this post says you are exaggerating your numbers.
What does alliance earning less than 2x the amount of honor have to do with honor gains, alliance get the same honor horde does. Should we punish them for being the lesser played faction in battlegrounds?
You’re not wrong for making this suggestion with the way the system currently is, but the fact that this is considered to be a good option due to how bad the grind is just shows how horrible it is. Skipping essentially an entire season to save up for the next one cause the grind is that bad is just incredibly depressing to think about, and more than warrants an honor fix/buff in my opinion.
They aren’t viable at all once you get past like 1200 rating. I feel like your view on this system is incredibly skewed due to watching your son play at like 200 rating. Any healer that has low resilience and is trying to get by with PvE gear is going to instantly die in the opener and stand no chance at climbing the ladder. Here is a clip of a literal Blizzcon winner, the highest level you can achieve in Wow PvP Arena, still getting 1 shot in an opener at 200 resilience:
ttps://clips.twitch.tv/TangentialOnerousThymeBudBlast-aXXEC8Ym1_xM22vY
When you consistently get blown up this hard, you start to get demotivated. You look for a solution, which BG gear SHOULD be, but then realize it will take you over 200 hours purely of BG farming to get to the point that you aren’t getting 1 shot in an opener, and you just disengage with the system and quit the game cause it’s too much of a time investment. Honor needs a serious buff to help people progress in PvP as opposed to being stuck in this terribly, insanely long grind just to compete at a level above 1200 rating.
That’s not the case at all due to winrates. Alliance are getting into more BGs cause their queues are a lot shorter, but Alliance still lose most BGs and you get much more honor for a win than a loss. If an Ally is able to squeeze 2 or even 3 BGs into the same time as Horde getting 1 BG, if they lose all 3 and Horde win their 1, Horde still comes out on top in terms of honor gained.
Right because 28 days after TBCC was launched most people are playing to the level/standard of “a literal Blizzcon winner” Thats a great example of the current state of the game.
Yah I agree, the honor grind formula from back then is dated and flawed with how the playerbase plays the game today.
I really do not think Blizzard will do much about it, though - which is unfortunate because it hurts the overall PvP community not having fresh players to make their own attempt.
I think Blizzard already completely screwed the integrity of Season 1 by not wiping honor at TBC launch and then adjusting honor rates a second time after the really hardcore players took advantage of capping flags in EOTS. As well as launching Season 1 2 weeks into an expansion like TBC - with only a 2 week pre patch.
I think Blizzard choosing to not wipe honor, and then adjusting rates a second time in EOTS is their answer to the community - the grind as it stands is a developer decision and working as intended.
You didn’t even watch the clip lmao. You’re so ignorant. I’m arguing the exact opposite of what you think I’m arguing. I’m arguing that in theory he should be able to get out of that damage via his skill, but due to not having enough resilience he gets 1 shot in an opener by players much worse than him. There’s no opportunity to “be viable” or outplay an opponent when the gear you have prevents you from surviving past 5 seconds in a match against semi competent players.