Bad class design (still)
Bad damage damage for how much effort is required
Bad survivability (shields do not help much in M+ when rot damage/random casts delete it in 1-2 seconds)
They make us viable in the 10.2 rework just to rugpull us because of augvokers. Meanwhile, Ret Paladins and Demon Hunters can play blindfolded, mashing their head against the keyboard, and beat out damage.
Luv me some fire. I mostly PVP tho with DPS close to or on top of the charts. The key for me is Mastery. (24%)
Mages have a variety of skills used to stay alive and arguably it is more difficult to learn that aspect of a mage then dps.
Tho I do not play thru many dungeons what I have learned is that a fire mage requires mobs to not be wiped out too quickly if we are to have a high dps. On the other hand we can do a lot of damage when it takes a minute.
I have a lvl 70 DH and it can do a lot of DPS but like a mage it can also be squishy if you do not learn how to keep it alive.
My 2 cents, good luck.
4 objectively incorrect points made, well done 
Skill issue.
I just came back a couple weeks ago and am enjoying fire. It’s very fluid and it’s probably the fastest playstyle I’ve ever seen with fire in a long time. Fire is one of the best M+ specs for damage so I’m not sure what issues you are having. Fire is ranked as S-tier and 2nd overall in most M+ dps rankings.
As with most tiers if you are running nothing but low keys you will not see fire’s full potential as everything dies too quick.
As for the design. I must say I was a huge fan of BFA’s fire and early legion fire (before the nerf) but this iteration of fire is probably my favorite. There’s literally no down time.
Came to say that aside from the other points, Fire is one of the most livelord specs in the game…
Barrier + Mass Barrier
Alter Time
Mirror Images
Ice Cold
Cheat death
If you can’t manage to stay alive with that many buttons idk what more blizz can do for you
fire is and has been trash since blizzard changed combustion from a spreadable dot to a cd.
i miss my fire mage just melting mobs with that rotation and playstyle. now it is just a dumpster fire of a playstyle.
I have been a fire mage since Legion and while I don’t excpect the glory days of BFA fire mage to come back it does feel like garbage. I am tired of the sunkings blessing playstyle no variation with the talents. I also don’t feel like fire dps is explosive like it used to be.
Love me a boosty boi in greens.
Post on your main, your comment is worthless.
Says the guy with one post on a Dracthyr alt. If you’re gonna call someone out don’t be a coward and a hypocrite about it. You post on YOUR main.
Seems like work to be honest.
If you are going to post on mage at least have KSH, or some heroic raid experience this season on your mage. Once you get into higher keys you need coordinated groups for huge pulls to see the benefit of fire. Even then standing there hardcasting pyro for SKB is stupid for CB. And in weeks like this with sanguine, volcanic and tyrannical, it’s all that more annoying.
Just tighten the timer ffs.
We have to decurse, move, cast, root, barrier and then keep our AOE rotations in check.
I’m shelving my mage after this season, I can faceroll on a warrior, hunter, ret paladin and do more dps easily. There is a reason why those classes are the most played. They are easy and much less squishy with instant skills and short CD’s.
There is so much movement in the game now with the mechanics - melee is having a field day. We have to talent into Icey Flows, which adds additional keys to press in our already bloated rotation which has 2sec castime and terrible damage outside of cooldowns such as IV or Combustion. There is no comparison between ranged casters that have to deal with castime, and melee with instants who can stand in sh*t and still dps.
In any case, there is 5% of players that excel at fire/frost/arcane and get into the 3k range in raider IO, however that’s not the norm, they have pre-canned groups and practice.
For arguments that relate to those players that this and that is possible, they are are a moot point, because they are M+ raiders and sweaties. Gingi for example is a different type of player with alot of the others. If you are running pugs in high keys, chances are you’re not topping meters with a DH, Hunter etc outside the 5%.
Couldn’t have said it better myself…
Twice the effort for the same result easier classes pull out effortlessly.
I tend to agree. I’ve played fire mage for years. In raids, I can definitely see a difference. Frost does significantly better damage than fire. I prefer fire tho. Sad.
This thread is like listening to a high school debate class, so many weak points…
Fire does take some coordination to pull off high dps, there’s nothing wrong with that.
Hey some of us just have pure unadulterated rage.
Sometimes, but not always. Posting on your Mage, allows people to see what content you are doing and likely talking about. There’s a huge difference between Normal and Mythic raiding, or a +5 and a +25 key.
Sometimes people like the theory behind a class, but dislike specific things about the gameplay. For example, some people would like Arcane if it didn’t rely on CD set up or mana, or like Fire without SKB etc. Same goes for people who remember when a spec was good, but no longer enjoy the playstyle. Elaborating on the why/what though is important, and saying “X class is bad” doesn’t help anyone.
DPS wise yes, it’s been pretty good, but there have been enough posts and players who have stipulated that there are particular aspects that they don’t enjoy. The “new” talent trees were a good way to separate playstyles, but Blizzard more or less borked that and made the specs just as cookie-cutter as vanilla/cata versions. Some players would rather not play a particular style/spec because of gameplay aspects regardless of output.
While generally true, I can’t think of a time in the last few expansions where Fire wasn’t top dog. The old argument was that Fire was more difficult to play and deserved higher damage, but these days that’s almost the opposite - Frost in M+ is far more difficult on an individual level.
But yes, OP has not really given us anything to go off. Their post comes off as obnoxious, and that of a petulant child. Without providing more information on why they feel Fire is bad, then their post is not worth the trouble.
In PVE Fire feels okay in terms of the basic rotation, but I will say something also feels… off? I don’t really know how to explain it. In some ways, it feels almost like it was tuned for groups with Aug/PI (neither of which I have access to regularly). It’s rare that I can spike the dps meters and I’m not entirely sure what I’m doing wrong. Every now and then, the planets align and I’m able to burst up to like… 500 or 600k, but most pulls I’m barely doing 150k if that.
Note that my mage is an alt and until fairly recently, has been on the back burner since WoD which was the last time I really enjoyed Fire.
This conversation isn’t worth my time.
good luck out there.
Bro you don’t even PvP, you opinion don’t matter. How you gonna tell someone how to PvP when you don’t even PvP…… “unhinged”
SPOT ON!
I think its great we have all this utility. But I just don’t find the mage specs fun right now. almost all of the classes are easier for better dps. It is a melee game at the moment. I think caster spells shouldn’t have a stationary requirement. We should all be able to cast while moving. Demo and BM hunter are very mobile, theres a reason why that is advantageous and meta.
Anyways the mage is getting shelved Im tired off all the frustration. The game shouldn’t be hard, or require me to to spend HOURS perfection my rotation only to have some silly mistep or mechanic send me to the bottom of the charts.
Switching to my ret like 60% of the player base. That spec is easy and fun. Its even relaxing and feels even better when you get 3rd on the dps meter and lose to the other 2 ret pallies while eating a sandwich and watching a tv show, lol