Turalyon used swords.
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Good catch there. I looked up Turalyon to see if I could find an example of him using a Mace and havenât been able to thus far. He of course uses his famous Sword currently in the live game.
Maraad does use a Mace, but I wouldnât exactly classify him as a Templar. His description does also include his title of Vindicator, so he likely should remain in his own realm of fantasy for now.
We really do not have a solid fleshed out idea of what a Templar is in World of Warcraft and this needs some help!
This would be my stance on it at the moment. Templar can only really be grounded from the WoW lore so far, as a type of Paladin/Priest Combatant as its currently defined on Wowpedia.
Taking a look at Uther, Turalyon, Tirion and MaraadâŚ
All are Paladins, for sure. But with a closer look at their class breakdown on Wowpedia, it lists them each as the following:
Uther: Paladin/Knight
Turalyon: Priest/Paladin
Tirion: Paladin/Knight/Warrior
Maraad: Paladin
So first things first, still no direct mention or class label of being a Templar for any of them sadly. But if you look at what they actually are, by definition, Turalyon would be the closest match we have.
If Lightâs Guidance is going to augment Wake of Ashes, from the Ashbringer, that correlates with Tirion a bit but that could be starting to stretch it.
Both do happen to use Swords and not Maces.
I will keep doing more deep diving to see what else I can really come up with in the lore. Iâll need to run around in game also and look around our Order Hall. Maybe some more context can be found there.
If I had to make a call now, Turalyon is our current and best example of what a Templar really looks like in World of Warcraft. None of the other Paladins feel quite on the same realm as him. His character and personality traits are unique and his priestly origins separate him from the others.
He should be the template to replicate from for our Hero Spec!
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Iâve been a classic Andy for some time now. It kinda feels like popular comps like ret hunter arenât going to be a thing anymore. This is purely a aoe build which would breaks traps and other CC. I was hoping Templar would be a cross between warrior and ret. Maybe a new striking ability. Ya know. One that applies mortal strike effectâŚ
Or even turning ret into a fire burn effects with radiant dmg to have dots you have to maintain. Dots that actually hurt instead of 2% of your overall dmg. Templar doesnât sound exciting. Pve. Sure. PvP I feel like we are a niche community and still donât have an identify and still a wheel chair spec.
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He uses a sword to honor his fallen hero, the Lion of Azeroth himself, Lord Anduin Lothar.
Before that, his personal and original weapon was, say it with me, a warhammer.
Read Tides of Darkness and The Dark Portal, Turalyonâs first appearances before he disappears from Azeroth.
According to lore, Tirion was only a warrior, not a knight. That honor belongs to Uther and Saidan Dathrohan.
You are obviously a man of refinement and culture.
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This is what Iâve found too, looking on wowpedia. Theyâre only mentioned by title for the Silver Hand and, in the non-canon rpg, the Argent Dawn. The Blood Knights donât have this rank, the closest being Knight-Lord, and the Sunwalkers donât even have a hierarchy that we know of. In the Silver Hand, they are ânot only the most skilled in battle, but also the most righteous in their demeanor. Strength of arms and purity of mind are strict requirements, and only those who possess both are named champions. They act as officers in the Order of the Silver Handâ. In the non-canon rpg, they studied all forms of combat and completely retrained themselves with new forms of combat and new uses of the Light (apparently able to cast holy lightning spells, which would be pretty cool). But the title of Templar is almost exclusively used by humans for what is essentially an NCO of their order. So itâs no wonder thereâs such a debate about the specifics of what the title means to everyone and what it should be attributing to the tree.
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frankly i really dont think the lore needs to be fleshed out more. because templar being âthe best human paladins and priestsâ already opens the door in so many ways.
like how it echoes in the herald of the sun thread. i feel like its best to not define it more or even make it more human centric than it already is. having it be a title is already enough to not alienate other paladins in RP or casual settings. since unlike herald of the sun which ignores all the sun based paladins (zandalari blood elve culture in general, and tauren paladins) templar is just a blank state with all paladins in wow culture unless stated other wise using hammers and what not. allowing players to just make their own rp and headcanons in this rpg
sometimes its just better that lore is low so the player has the freedom to be as creative as possible. with templars in paladin lore being so moldable to paladins in general since the only notable prerequisite is having strength of arms and indominable will.
that being said, i wouldnt mind if they added glyphs to change all hammers to swords
this being a prime example and why templar should remain static and vague. making it more human centric you risk alienating and humanizing all the fantastic different paladin lore we have. trying to make it into a cookie cutter shape.
The problem some of us are having is that the world templar is strictly a human thing already. Theyâre already alienating and humanizing all the paladin lore. Blood Elves donât have templars. Sunwalkers donât have templars. The Draeneiâs Hand of Argus donât have templars. The Zandalari Prelates donât have templars. The one, singular, paladin order that calls any of their members templars is the Humanâs Silver Hand. Why donât we call the tree Vindicators? Knight-Lords? Prelates? Those terms mean just as little to the human players as Templar means to non-human players. Herald of the Sunâs name is doing generic, race amorphic, tone better than Templarâs and even that has lore/RP issues.
This is a gross misunderstanding of Blood Elf culture. The âsunâ for us is the Sunwell, not the literal sun, which was named after DathâRemar Sunstrider, the founder of QuelâThelas (aka the Blood Elf kingdom). The Sunwell didnât even have connections to the sun, or even the Light, until it was sanctified by Velen at the end of Sunwell Plateau. It used to be pure arcane energy and is now a mix of arcane and holy. Even Blood Elf naming conventions reference the Sunwell, not the sun in the sky, whenever they use the word sun.
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This is because you arenât real paladins, just pale imitations of us TRUE paladins.
Get in line behind us. 
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thats a fair point but considering it still had sun in its name, wouldnt you agree that it would have been nice to see âsunwells graceâ instead of âsolar graceâ in the hero talent tree?
So the Templar one for paladin is lookin pretty good overall, though im wondering about if lightâs deliverance adds duration to shake the heavens or if it just refreshes, if it just refreshes then thereâs lost value and synergy with that.
I feel that if they are making Wake of Ashes a primary part of our hero talents for both Templar and Herald, then that should be a baseline ability rather than a talent. Even on live, it is not an optional talent for any content; this talent node could be better used to give some build variety from aoe and single target builds. Perhaps a choice node that modifies Wake of Ashes to either hit just one target and hitting multiple talents (I am aware of Seething Flames, but this is mostly required as well and could be better used as a talent that either increases Holystrike or radiant damage)
That is an issue on blizzards part. The paladin class we have now was born out of a single culture (alliance priests worshippers of the light who took up arms to defend their world and learned to wield the light in battle along their big weapons) I wont get into the argument whos the real paladin race or not but they shot themselves in the foot by mindlessly adding races to a class that visually, aesthetically and across their entire history has been represented by one faction alone (three races). So not your fault or anyones but blizzards.
99% of paladin lore in wow IS human, the greatest stories and paladins in lore (good or bad) were/are humans. This goes back to the last paragraph, I get you want your representation but not much of nonhuman lore has stuck with people. Even here in the paladin forums most devoted paladin mains can probably name a single âimportantâ character per race (if any) but thats it. Since most paladin stuff is human well most their designs are gonna stem from that as well.
So I wouldnt look at it that much, theres no solution in sight for that
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FEEDBACK
I dont think Im crazy when I say thr capstone has to be changed.
I would rather have it redesigned conpletely (ret already lives tracking divine arbiter and reckoning stacks) is not the end of the world to add yet another counter but there are better solutions to this.
I get blizzard tried to have it always âsyncedâ with woa no matter what but that makes the spell feel like lost value. You could instead.
-lower the amount of stacks needed so when at full stacks it briefly enables wake to be used off cd (enabling hammer of light to be used next and be free). Once the small window is done return wake to its normal cd separated from the reset effect. This may be fun at 1ppm maybe?
-do the math so the amount of stacks is mostly met before or right when wake cd is back.
What we dont want is to get full stacks and have to wait 26 seconds for them to be used. Or be close to full and havr to desync wake just because we need the free finisher to smooth out burst windows.
Or maybe the intent of the capstone is for HoL to never have a cost? Playing the empyrean hammer minigame but if this is the case then capstone needs to be added to the base spell. Feels cheap to get a capstone that only makes the spell actually useable.
Doesnât change the fact he uses a sword.
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Havenât really formed an opinion on the rest of it, but Iâd like it if âBonds of Fellowshipâ was moved and changed. It should be a choice talent with Sacrosanct crusade, providing an absorb shield to both the Paladin and the recipient for like 15 of their HP when Blessing of Sacrifice is used
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Thatâs because Turalyon figured heâd throw lesser paladins a bone. Gotta give them reason to hope theyâll become true paladins, eh? 
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Nah, real paladins when bringing retribution gives a quick and painless death.
Maces gives a slow and very painful death.
Mace = lesser
Great swords = greater 
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If I thought they were willing to make the trees race specific, yes. But these are supposed to deepen class identity, not race identity, so Iâd rather if there was actually as little race representation as possible in the naming schemes. I think things can be more generic/amorphic and still sound exciting (âRadiant Zealotâ, âFlame[s] of Justiceâ, âBurning Righteousnessâ for three quick examples [I did not check to make sure these donât exist elsewhere]). Maybe Iâm the weird one here, though.
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Youâre absolutely correct, and back when they did give solid lore reasons for Belf and Draenei paladins, they took the effort to make them visually and aesthetically distinct. But they gave up on that distinction when they realized class balance is more important than race identity. Iâm okay with that, I accept that gameplay comes first. But this has no impact on balance and just feels like the team giving up before the finish line. I just donât see the word âTemplarâ in my head when I read the talents.
Also feels kind of weird for us to get a tree named after officers of the Silver Hand when we, canonically, are still the Highlord of the Silver Hand. I donât think the player ever actually steps down as Highlord⌠I could be wrong though.
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Then it would never be chosen because it competes with a damage nodeâŚ
Itâs perfectly fine where it is and in fact we need more choices node like the Sac/steed one tbh.
They could just make the âprocâ usable as long as WoA is on CD
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