There is objectively nothing in the Templar tree that is “literally Icecap”.
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Hammer of Light sight unseen as it is, do we really need another hammer ability? Differentiating this ability from our now essentially baseline Final Verdict visually will likely be difficult and therefore a bit of a let down as something that is tied to our “hero” talents.
Taking the visual from the now defunct Templar’s Verdict connecting with our target and exaggerating that as a visual for this new 5 HP spender could look cool and lend some visual variety to our class.
Same applies to Prot, but to a lesser degree.
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My mistake, I rushed to make the post. The talent I should had referred to is shake the heavens.
I think it could be really cool, though I think I would’ve liked to see it be ‘sword of light’ or something instead. This is a small gripe, and to be fair they can definitely make Hammer of Light visually amazing, but we have so many hammer animations already I almost want this to just be Sword of Light instead lol. Maybe that wouldn’t look as good though, falling hammers tend to look much better I think. I guess we’ll see, I think the tree sounds very cool but it really needs to be visually appealing.
They can differentiate from our other hammer animations pretty easily imo, especially since these are supposed to be falling hammers (I assume like ES) but we’ll see.
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keep in mind that prot paladin is drowning in r esources so spending 5 hopo for a nuke and keep 90+% sotr uptime is easy
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Shake the Heavens isn’t Icecap either. Like the poster you replied to said, there is nothing in the tree that is like Icecap. The only thing that’s somewhat close is ‘Higher Calling’ but that is extending duration directly via using abilities, icecap doesn’t do that.
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If they were SotR uptime would be 100%.
HP is generation is “ok” but the playstyle doesn’t match the intended design they had for prot at the beginning of DF.
They didn’t want us to spam Sotr but they never supplement this philosophy with any actual talent and instead kept all the talents that interacted and encouraged spamming it.
Prot is “working” but it is by no mean because it was well designed.
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Yeah thats kind of what my complaint boils down to. A Blade of Light would look way cooler to me, but thats subjective and they absolutely have the ability to make it look incredible. I’m a little miffed that Final Verdict looks like the grand marshal vanilla mace still, hopefully they polish that ability’s look a bit as well.
I’m assuming that the intended complaint is that Shake the Heavens sounds mechanically similar to Avalanche from the FDK tree?
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I do not want to spec wake of ashes, so just don’t play this char this xpac?
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So you’re not playing in DF either I get?
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Why are you even playing Ret then? Lmao
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sotr is 100% uptime
warcraftlogs com/reports/DdXPw67QkrY4G3Nz#fight=12&type=auras&source=17
i mean i dont think i ever seen blizzard say this, even if they did they clearly went back on it post paladin rework with all the support prot has with hopo generation. all 3 paladin specs has alot of hopo generation so its just weird that this is a complaint tbh
theres prot issues yes but non of them hamper or amplify the hero talents. templar is just “more damage” for prot paladin and tank mains love damage
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Historically accurate templars were primarily bankers who made lots of money trading in IOU’s for gold and stuff. Also they were eventually disbanded by the church for being corrupt.
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They did.
Avenger’s Shield is intentionally no longer generating Holy Power. This is part of an effort to constrain Shield of the Righteous uptime, and transfer some of protection paladins’ defensive power out of Shield of the Righteous and into other cooldowns and forms of mitigation. We want Shield of the Righteous to feel like it makes you strong, rather than an essential component of your baseline passive survivability.
They didn’t, not officially.
And beside moving around the talents, it’s the same HP generation from the start of DF.
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This tree to me isn’t as offensive as the rogue tree for example, I do feel that the theme of a templar isn’t exactly shining through here though. A few extra hammers falling down… that’s it? Doesn’t really feel much different than a regular paladin if I’m honest. I think there could be more work done there.
I will say, regarding Hammer of Light, I do enjoy that it replaces a current ability already in use (mostly, if you talent it) so that it doesn’t add to bloat or complexity much, but please, I really hope if you’re going to add this into the mix, please have a look at reducing the amount of other extra buttons that are already in the rotation (divine toll, final reckoning being the main ones) all needing to be used alongside this new ability (essentially you can’t opt out of wake of ashes anymore so that’ll be 3 abilities just by themselves.) It already feels too much currently.
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It drops hammers on foes heads on when a conditional is met.
Icecap does that too but it’s balls of ice. Same thing.
Nothing exciting in this tree. Might as well call it ret 1.1
Nothing screams templar.
In fact it is closer to dk now.
To those who might comment on this, I currected myself later;
welp they obviously failed then, that being said i still dont understand how people think the hopo cost of hammer is gonna be negative to prot paladin in anyway.
templars in wow lore wer ejust “stronger paladin” its just a title. i dont think the game itself fleshed out templar in any other way but “stronger paladin” and frankly we are stronger paladins so it just checks out
…the simplification of ret already caused alot of damage and you want to simplify it even more? like there is no way to simplify the spec even more than how it is now. besides making it a two button spec like shadowlands havoc demon hunter. even then its dangerously close to being that in concept.
further more the amount of people who are upset that its wake of ashes/ refuse to play wake of ashes is just extremely disturbing.
thats a gross simplification of everything. borderline ignorant. yalls expectation for heros talents were unrealistically high to begin with not to mention tainted already with this weird “false” definition of templar
Can people be serious, it doesn’t really matter that it is all about Wake of Ashes. If you don’t want to spec wake in general, you probably should not play ret as that is one of our strongest abilities. It also looks very cool but thats besides the point. There is really not much you can do if you don’t want to spec wake in the first place, missing a big part of ret.
My main gripe so far with the tree: Sacrosanct crusade seems fairly weak, a lot of trees are getting pretty good passive defensive buffs/additions, I would ideally like this to go to 20 or 25% effectiveness for SoV. SoV already gets eaten through in pvp very quick.
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It’d take you all of literally 15seconds to google Icecap and see that this is not what Icecap does.
Entirely subjective and that’s unfortunate for you. There’s easily things I find exciting, such as the massive boost to ST without any AoE loss.
This is such an asinine statement I don’t even know where to begin.
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Hammer of Light, may it be cast multiple times during the 12 seconds following WoA if we can build 10 or 15 holy power to use on it, or just once per WoA cast?
Just guessing, for pvp Retribution players will opt for only single target Judgments other than divine toll AND work to target only one player if possible with WoA and HoL(Hammer of Light) for the most ST damage potential.
Is there talks of allowing players to opt to only have HoL be able to do ST damage to take advantage of that 30% increase on a single target struck by it?
Endless Wrath, will we lose the same function in our spec tree or have it additionally in the Hero tree?
Sacrosanct Crusade, just a good talent, not super impactful but helpful.
Unrelenting Charger should remove snares, roots, slows, or suppress ones recieved while it is active. Currently in pvp Steed and Blessing of Freedom must be used together to utilize Steeds movement(you can remain stationary or slower than regular walking with Steed active without also using bubble or Blessing of Freedom).
Empyrean Hammer, are Rets going to need to stack crit for pvp I wonder because we will want this to function. Maybe choose a more likely interaction Ret can utilize while we currently stack Vers>Mastery>Haste>Crit.
Santification, does damage or duration overlap or both?
Empyrean Hammers in PVP, will these be dispelled or have dispell backlash? If the effect is removed constantly in pvp the entire Templar tree will be opted out of by the pvp community who will use Herald instead where we wont benefit from its AoE focused talents much at all, this is my largest concern.
Quite excited to see Beta go live to get some leveling and then testing done.
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