Why not do Premonition like an empower ability, but you cant unlock the last tier of it until you cast all 3 versions? This way you get to choose the one you want, it gets rid of the rotational aspect people dont seem to like, and still achieves the core vision of the ability Blizz seems intent on?
(Edit)
Also, what about changing Diving Feathers to be a self buff that you can recast within 10(?)seconds. Recasting give you a small target reticle which allows you to jump to that spot. Landing on one or several ally(s) gives them the movement buff of Angelic Feather. Or maybe you can still place the feather but you can still also recast to jump and give you another single ally the movement buff.
Only issue with this type of added feature is that Divine Feather is only accessible via Oracle which means 2/3 of the Hero Paths still have no displacement which unless they get their own versions then it would just be a sad reminder for the other non Oracle priests that they done have a displacement lol.
But the idea in of itselfâŚ
I do think it would be cool if after you place a Feather down, you get 6 second window to use again and you will sprout wings and leap / fly to that location and maybe everyone within your path of travel get the speed bonus from feather. Just slap on an internal cooldown of 1-2 minutes so you cant do this for every feather and it should be both interesting and fit with the priest aesthetic.
Thinking it would act like one of or a combination of Reverse Leap of Faith (without requiring a target) or like Demon Hunters Fel Rush or Warriors Heroic Leap.
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If this was true, it would actually fit the moniker of Oracle.
But you donât have to plan ahead. You just hit it on CD. None of them are going to majorly change your rotation, especially now. The only thing you might do is hold off on popping it if youâre about to delay your raid CD (or your burst healing).
This plays nothing like Astrologian. Only the Power Infusion version (where you had separate buffs youâd want to place on different kind of DPS) sounded anything like Astro - and FFXIV is scrapping that version of astro anyway.
I donât think we should be comparing it to Astro. Right now itâs basically just a rotating healing buff youâll use whenever.
I donât know why people keep calling this a âsupportâ spec or support lite or whatever. Youâre not doing anything to buff people. These are just short term healing buffs.
I still think itâs just super cumbersome and thatâs the real problem with it. The buffs arenât exactly inspiring. The only one thatâs really worth its salt in power is Piety. But the only one that could do something cool for your rotation is Insight.
Unfortunately, insight is pretty weak for BOTH specs, so youâre just gonna blow it on whatever CD without thinking just to get it out of the way and get more pietys.
And in the end isnât that the greatest condemnation of this whole tree? The ability you want to get to using is just a weakened version of a trinket from Legion. The whole rest of the ability and all of itâs âsupporting talentsâ are just a burden and in your way.
Yeah, I still think the tree is pretty bad.
Honestly, I think the current changes somehow made it worse than it was before - just worse in a different way.
Nobody wanted to take the talent that alternated the spell only when you cast Premonition. It was considered to be strictly a nerf to the spec (because it was strictly better to just focus on Piety). But now itâs the baseline functionality of the spec, and nothing was really done to make any of the other casts more attractive. So weâve got 2 buffs we still donât want and piety, but now you can have piety about half the amount of times you could before!
What I will give them is buffing up the defensive aspects of the tree is good. Stopping PW:S and PoM from being rotational for their opposite specs is also good. But those are the only positive here. The rest just got worse.
No matter which way you slice it, devs, Premonition needs to be more impactful.
Speaking directly in terms of Holy, hereâŚ
Premonition of Piety is fine.
Premonition of Insight needs to be reworked. If it did something like, âYour next Holy Word converts its healing into a Shield at 1.5x effectivenessâ, that would be âinsightâ and âseeing into the futureâ to protect your allies from incoming harm.
Youâd be able to throw out a Serenity or Sanctify before big incoming damage to shield allies. Give it a unique-looking spell effect and bam, you have something cool.
Premonition of Solace is boring and bad gameplay that allows for mistakes not on the userâs part.
If I use Premonition of Solace, preparing for the tank to take a hit, then oops, a DPS takes a hit or takes aggro and needs to be healed, well Iâve just wasted it on them instead.
Why not do something like âYour next Holy Word does not spend its charge.â?
Still boring, but at least it would feel good, and is significantly more impactful than 5 seconds of cooldown like Insight had. This also plays well with Divine Image.
âBut all three of those are too strong!â
Really? Compared to Archonâs mega-halo bouncing with 25% uptime, all while doing DPS and slowing enemies for one button press and zero extra effort?
Please. Oracle will remain in a weak and unplayable state until itâs actually given meaningful Premonition spells.
2 Likes
At least to some degree here itâs difficult to provide proper feedback because itâs unknown if thereâre a bunch of awesome changes in the works for Holy Priests that may affect some of these things.
While, in my opinion, itâs unfortunate that Premonition has moved away from its support nature, this does still have the potential to be exciting, but currently I do have some concerns.
Premonition of Insight
Insight is great:
- Shorter Prayer of Mendings
- Shorter Purifyâs * â Though, I agree with some other comments about not giving us a perpetually shorter purify CD⌠it has been acceptable for 2 specs to not have access to an Interrupt (the same two specs affected by the Purify option), and one of the consequences of that is that more harmful DoTs can go out, requiring more Purifys
- Shorter Circle of Healings
But mostly the shorter Purifys. As a person who PuGs a lot of M+, thereâs often the potential for missed kicks, and so any option I can have to help my groups is ideal. That last part is my central grievance, though: itâs difficult to help my group. Weâll come back to that in a bit. For now, that thereâs less access to Insight is unfortunate. 
Premonition of Piety
Velenâs Future Sight, and the Smoldering Seedling, are great options in raid⌠but kind of hit or miss in M+. In M+, Holyâs issue is that persistent, particularly strong, AoE damage, canât be responded to easily. Right now we have a workaround in that we have an overflow of Holy Words due to our tier set, so we can throw up to four Holy Word: Sanctifyâs in a row⌠more with Apotheosis, or send Holy Word: Serenitys left, right, and center (look under your seats, everyone), blended in with Flash Heals (probably several of them as Surge procs).
We recently saw that Divine Hymn was being changed to be better in dungeons, which is fantastic, but no word yet on Prayer of Healing (in truth, PoH has probably lost its luster in raids, as well, due to circumstances). Maybe it is, if Chain Heal is indeed becoming something Shaman are going to use more? Donât know.
Getting back to damage⌠in Holyâs current state, damage events happen and we respond to whomever survived the event. Everyone was topped off, of course, and then itâs a matter of "Not Even Close"ing it on various class defensives. We have one external in Guardian Angel, and if it does what itâs there for, then itâs not available again for 3 minutes. Coming back to the bit from earlier: Holy needs a second external, and while a 2nd charge of GA is okay, thereâs the PvP button Ray of Hope that would be absolutely lovely instead. Would even be OKay with sharing Ray of Hope with Discipline through Oracle if we get 2 charges of GA, but that might be a bit much. Anyway, continuing⌠this mostly benefits from excess AoE healing, e.g. PoHâing or DHâing 3 healthy targets to redirect that healing to lower health targets. For that to be worthwhile⌠PoH has to ⌠not suck (great change to Hymn, though!).
Premonition of Solace
This is all right, though hopefully it would work on more than one spell. With Holy, the issue is that people have to live through damage in order to be healed back up, and since Damage Reduction is more the realm of Discipline, filling a bar is generally the easy part, as long as HP > 0.
General Talents
Preventative Measures
I donât know if itâs really a preventative measure for PoMâs healing to be increased by 15%. This is likely a hot take, but why isnât Power Word: Shield something Holy Priests want to cast (the question is rhetorical, I know why)? Maybe a Prayer of Mending talent in the Holy tree could be adjusted to make PS a desirable button.
Prophetâs Will
Doing 30% more Serenity healing to myself is great⌠if I survive the hit. I liked the concept way back of Power Word: Shield being a defensive option⌠but Holy Priests have the weakest shields of the 3 specs for some reason.
Desperate Measures
The changes to Desperate Measures are good, though. Hopefully something is being done to Angelic Bulwark to make it a more ideal defensive option⌠it is a capstone.
Waste No Time
Hopefully Prayer of Healing will be something I want to cast other than that it is a pretty spell and that if I have absolutely nothing going on I can use it to CDR Sanctify.
Foreseen Circumstances
2 seconds on Guardian Spirit is still nowhere close to 10% DR on Pain Suppression. At least right now, with there being the single use of Guardian Spirit⌠maybe thereâs something cooking?
Maybe some of these things are going to be addressed with some adjustments to the class & spec trees for Holy .
I am getting concerned for oracle (especially the overheal sharing) with the changes to how healing seems to be going.
At least while leveling we seem to be heading back to a slower, triage model of healing where it is normal for people to be less than 100% health.
This makes piety almost worthless as if you never heal people to 100% then almost all the value of the overheal spread is negated. Either because you generate no overheal or because there is no mechanic which will oneshot people hovering between 40 and 70% health which is the reason we like an overheal mechanic in current content.
Maybe this will change in mythic raids and dungeons but if this model sticks it makes the oracle buffs much less useful and thus the whole hero spec less desirable.
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I noticed this as well; I was struggling to get out heals out to keep people up while draining my mana dry. While in the same gear and same dungeon using Archon, I was not OOM, and my party wasnât not at deaths door.
Well with the release date just being confirmed as August 26th I think we can put a stake through oracle being good or cohesive and start lobbying for them to do a total revamp in 10.1 or 10.2.
I am particularly concerned by Fatespinners report on the beta forums saying that oracle holy priest is an underpowered mana hog as I am not seeing similar reports for Archon from either him or other sources and there is no easy way to add power to the current oracle tree given the design of the core features.
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So Dragonflight 2.0 again lol.
I love how Ian even stated that Priests deserve better or something like that and here we go again⌠no real major changes until mid expansion most likely lol.
2 Likes
I wish that after 19 years they would have at least learned that trash goes in the trashbin at earliest opportunity. Had they yeeted âOracleâ in its entirety and started over when they said they were going to Plan B, we would have a 3rd functional hero spec. Instead they dug in REPEATEDLY and across multiple bad mechanics, so we get what we have here.
You could do a 5-minute pass and convert Voidweaver â Star(holy)weaver and it would absolutely outperform Oracle.
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I have no access to beta yet, but I play priest with the three specs to know one thing or two and I do watch the forums and many content creators/ Mythic raiders and M+ players feedback closely, besides me being a game developer.
Main issue
The problem with Oracle is the lackluster buffs and the misconception of Premonition, mainly exacerbated, probably, by being the only two healer hero talent tree.
While the first iteration was amazing for the conception, it was gameplaywise horrendous to play with, and this last one is easy to manage but horrible in the fantasy/power aspect.
Both the specs play too different, but we can find middle ground if we take a closer look at their core gameplay and spec fantasy to make something useful for both while being achiavable for devs in due time and enhancing gameplay enough for the players.
Possible solutions
Holy this last expansion has mainly revolved around Prayer of Mending and steady heals, while discipline had itâs shield powers cut off coming to dragonflight but kept itâs burst element.
Assured Safety does make one tap into another for a bit and have been met quite fondly for the community, perhaps this talent tree should revolve around it, making one spec tap into another, mainly because we are the only class with two healing specs that play that much different.
Here are some ideas that accomplish my statements: Hero talent fantasy, development easiness and powerful enough but not disruptive:
- My first idea is to turn Premonition into an this active buff:
For Discipline: Makes your healing spells seize the future for 10 sec. X amount of your heal/overheal converts into an Ward for 20sec. The next time the player takes damage, an amount of the Ward is consumed to heal the player for a maximum of Y% of playerâs total health (0.Zs ICD).
For Holy: Makes your healing spells seize the future for 15 sec. X amount of your heal/overheal converts into an Ward for 20sec. Every Z seconds an amount of your Ward is consumed to form an absorbtion shield for Y% of playerâs total health.
-
Delete Premonition of Insight and Premonition of Solace buffs and leave Premonition of Piety be the only buff, tuning accordingly.
-
Make Premonition be a passive buff that converts X amount of overheal into shielding for a maximum of Y% playerâs health (like Empowered Chrysalis)
Nonetheless a change is needed for Oracle so it can be at least useful and coherent.
2 Likes
Given Archon exists as the throughput hero tree, would it be too broken if Oracle were to exist as the group/raid-wide Restitution tree? Specifically, it would negate a death in the group/raid on a 3-5 minute cooldown timer at the expense of personal throughput.
Like say, someone dies, then you turn them into a Spirit of Redemption for 30 seconds, except they can move, attack and cast while also not taking any damage.
Probably would be broken and abuseable at the highest tiers of play ngl.
i have beta and let me tell you. Im super bummed out about the state of this expansion thanks to the class designs.
I am waiting for their first Beta patch changes before I give feedback but damâŚ
Game is coming out in AUGUST man.
They have June and July to get this right and I donât see them making big progressâŚ
This feels just like shadowlands and dragonflight⌠unfinished by release.
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I am thinking Oracle will be useable in 11.2 or maybe 12.0 
. What is your guess?
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never cause the core design is bad.
We will have to wait for the next expac and pray for mass reworks. Im this close to bailing.
Im just hoping maybe shaman gets its own salvation.
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Oh of course, I didnât mean they would somehow make the current iteration of Oracle work. I meant it would take them an entire expansion cycle to admit they were dead wrong and redo it from scratch.
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the funny thing is the ideas are good.
The new talent trees in DF â Great
Hero talents - -great
Execution â poor.
You cannot add these things and keep the same fail designs.
You know why your classes suck, because you keep the bad designs.
They need to Change it up completely.
Remove this dumb resource management that plagues every class now. Stop making them all feel the same.
Remove the idea of giving every class everything.
Standardized what classes bring to the table vs the other, as well as what should be standard for every class. That way they can actually be different.
And if you wonât do that.
AT least remove this potato before it goes live.
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It would be nice if the Premonition icons were changed for ones with the drawing of the runes that are activated in the animation, it would make the visual association easier.