Feedback: Frostfire in The War Within

Comet storm should crit via combust as well, so it’d be equal. If it doesnt already, then they’ll make it. All mage spells are effected by combust after all, Arcane Explosion, Shifting Power, Ice Nova.

Could also include ice floes as thats a frost spell, but 10% is rather pitiful still.

Casting fire as a frost mage in PvP is just bad game design. If I get kicked on frostfire bolt I can’t dragons breath lol. Not a big deal, but could be more ideal like not taking away frostbolt and making a frost heavy hero talent option for pvp MAYBE WITH DEEP FREEZE.

I am more of a purist and think these trees should not borrow from other specs. I.e. Fire should be fire, arcane arcane and frost frost.

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Meltdown is stupid, triggering blast wave when iceblock expires is stupid. Knockback DR means if you knock back once, you can’t knock back again. They are immune. This means you can’t knockback a second time when you might actually need it. Not being able to knock someone back for the next 30 seconds because they were stacked on you when you were ice blocked is going to be very tilting.

I am hoping that tier is a choice between meltdown and imbued warding because meltdown will not be the choice for pvp.

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Frostfire empowerment is bad too. We already have frostbomb, comet storm, ice nova and too many CC breaks. The last thing we need is our frostfire bolt to have a chance to explode and break polymorphs lol.

I don’t see this tree being very popular in PvP. If you get kicked on Frostfire Bolt, it locks you out of both spell schools. That’s the way it worked in Wrath, anyway.

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I mean that only takes you out of ring of fire blast, blastwave, and fireblast afaik. There are many fire spells as a frost mage to begin with. I don’t understand this at all, and I feel like we are missing a ton of information.

Dragon’s Breath too.

Sunfury and Spellslinger are two different trees that haven’t been shown yet. You only get to spec into one tree at a time.

Think Covenants but less trash, as you can freely swap them at will, with no cost.

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Totally forgot about that

The auto cast ice nova is a bit of a concern in m+ where getting random roots can stop some mobs from being knocked when you/your team planned to cc them, or may root mobs in sanguine.

Ideally we get a talent in the class tree that removes the root effect in favor of slows on the targets hit by ice nova/frost nova (and for frost also applies a 1s Winters Chill which is equal to the minimum root duration) to fix this issue. Its been very prevalent on frost for a while, and I do think Excess Frost is good with Ice Nova as the trigger spell.

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Although the name “Frostfire” is kind of iconic, I also would’ve been fine with Cryopyro. :laughing:

As for the tree itself, as a frost mage, I absolutely love it. At the end of the day it’s mostly all just passives that don’t require you to change your main rotation at all but that’s good, in my opinion. I like frost’s rotation as it is and since you have to choose one hero spec or the other, I see no reason to impose too many changes. I just get to enjoy the flavor of fire effects going off alongside my frost effects and most importantly FROSTFIRE BOLT IS BACK, BABY!

Edit: Forgot to switch to my mage main before posting. Oopsie!

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I don’t like how icelance can apply living bomb. Very bad for pvp. We have too many cc breaks. Comet, ice nova, frost bomb, and now living bomb. Hmmm.

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Also who is in charge of proof reading, did you guys have to outsource after laying so many off? Some of your senteces on the tooltips have 2 spaces after the word too.

It should be “except”

Are we getting significant class and spec changes in the expansion launch?

I feel like that affects how we would view the hero talents.

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I get it now lol

:laughing:
Your personality. Damn it, we need emojis in WoW. Fml.

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It might not be, but the 8% haste is so fricking good. Hopefully spellsling and sunfury will have 8% haste and might have some better options for PvP.

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I am so NOT looking forward to Flame & Frost. That’s the “using defensives for throughput gain” discussion all over again. Please remove.

Not super happy with these for PvP myself. Mostly because of the extra CC breaks from random living bombs and frostfire bolt exploding randomly, but also because my frostbolt is gone and I’ll be fire locked for casting my main damaging ability - frostfire bolt. As a pvp frost mage, I am praying spellslinger is better.

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I may have missed it in the post or someone may have already said this, but our masteries will likely need to be tweaked to make these hybrid school hero talents feel viable.

Arcane’s mastery only affects arcane damage.
Fire’s mastery is only affected by fire spells.
Frost’s mastery only affects / is triggered by frost spells.

If we want Hero talents that encourage the use of spells outside of our schools, updating our masteries to affect / be affected by those spells will feel better. I’m going to assume that in this case Frostfire bolt will proc the same things that fireball and frostbolt currently do, but what about the other spells? If they aren’t scaling off our existing talents and stats, they’re going to feel much weaker than they should.

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Do we know what Fire spells Frost will have access to and be expected to use within their rotation? A number of these talents reduce cooldown on Fire spells, but does that now mean Frost is having to weave in things like Meteor? Aside from the clear fact that ability bars are already bloated, and that without merging or removing abilities there will be no room for Fire spells, I can’t imagine many Frost players are looking forward to having to weave (and potentially shatter) more spells as part of their rotation.

Excess Frost/Fire will be a nightmare in M+ I suspect, especially on Sanguine weeks. Tanks trying to shift mobs out of the healing pools, only to have them frozen repeatedly. Not taking that talent removes the CMS cooldown reduction, so it’s a dps loss not to take it.

We get FFB to replace Frostbolt/Fireball which is great visually, but is mechanically wonky especially without knowing how it will work. Currently Frostbolt is a quicker cast but deals less damage, while Fireball is slightly slower but hits harder. The DPET is not the same though. Will FFB be a new spell on its own with new coefficient/DPET or will it just replace Frostbolt/Fireball and keep their coefficients?

The rest is just passives, which honestly you could just bake most of into the existing trees and replace some of the garbage in there. Replace the MI talents with the extra barrier strengths for example. They might fix things up, but honestly none of this is that exciting. What I’d be more excited for is a “we’ve taken on feedback about gameplay and the new talent trees, and are looking at ways to make the specs feel better to play”. If it’s just the same old stuff with a different colour, then they’ve achieved nothing.