For people who are really bad at the game and only do LFR it is the most toxic community. Dont listen to these people. Watch a couple videos on how to tank join a normal/heroic guild and they will help you.
Dont do LFR bad players and a toxic community
After reading further into this thread, I’m thinking the OP getting kicked had less to do with not knowing the role and asking for help, and much more to do with his or her abrasive personality.
And I’m thinking you’re the type to tell a newer player to git gud and act all surprised when they don’t respond very nicely to that.
Like heck, all I did was pull adds off the main tank and drawing them to the main boss to be cleaved down for the fight as it wasn’t necessary to switch, and we wiped. I watched the video guide and guess what?
That’s exactly what the tank not aggroing the boss was supposed to be doing.
I mean this is actually fairly well constructed, and not that dickish at all compared to some other people.
And I’m thinking that for someone who gets up in arms at someone leaping to conclusions without evidence, you sure have no problem doing exactly the same thing.
Your overly defensive personality probably prevented you from seeing that both I and Doragodxo were supporting your pov while also offering some suggestions for how you can avoid this type of situation in the future.
I’m actually perfectly fine giving new players helpful advice and patience. When they choose to get defensive and argumentative, my patience and inclination to help evaporates very quickly.
Your claim is that is all you did. Based on the evidence here, in the conversation following the wipe you were almost certainly insufferable and removed from the raid. Not for being new, but for being annoying.
By the way, he didn’t kick you. They kicked you. It takes 5 people just to nominate you for kicking and then a majority of the raid has to say yes.
In the short term, your best bet is to avoid typing anything while in groups. It’s better to say nothing and be thought a fool than to say something and confirm it.
In the long term, you’ll need to try to develop your interpersonal skills if you would like to have more positive group experiences. It will help you in the real world as well.
Oh no I saw your support. If “getting defensive and argumentative” when I find fault with advice that is passive-aggressive in nature is something you don’t like, okay then. Maybe people choose to get “defensive and argumentative” to you because the advice is given in a condescending fashion?
I mean I talked a bit to ask for advice (obviously as indicated in the opening post), but aside from a few jests here and there with the other raiders, nothing blaming other players or anything.
If you want people to take your advice without being “defensive and argumentative”, you probably shouldn’t do it in such a condescending fashion as, “I hope you realize that in the time you’ve been in this thread so far, you could have watched a video for every boss in the raid.” You complain about defensiveness and argumentativeness, yet you act in patronizing manner and get huffy when people don’t like that.
Hell I’ll even word the first paragraph of that post in a way that isn’t condescending:
“While it is certainly uncalled for to be actively rude to a new player who is asking for help, it’s also a good idea to look into the raid before queueing for it. I’d recommend watching a video for each boss in the raid.”
And that’s not even getting into the second paragraph.
This isn’t about me. I generally don’t have any problems with people accepting help or advice. I condescend when people need it. Like you.
I don’t believe you have the self awareness required to correctly assess how any of your comments are received by others.
Make no mistake, I don’t care if you take my advice or not. I came into the thread because I saw someone make a mostly legitimate complaint and then get hyper defensive when they got support, but not the right kind. I tried to redirect you a little bit and you reacted even worse.
I’m not complaining about defensiveness or argumentativeness, I’m identifying it. I frankly don’t care enough about you to get upset by it.
Your rewording may be similar to what I would have chosen for a recipient that wasn’t acting the way you have been acting. You may have misunderstood that my tone wasn’t an accident, or a result of poor communication skills. It was chosen expressly because it was what you need to hear.
Honestly if your logic is that people responding negatively to condescendingness (not even from you) such as “not sure why this is a surprise tbh” is “defensiveness” then you really need a reality check.
Right, because giving advice even in a dick-ish fashion is always going to be well received.
It’s basic logic that people aren’t going to listen someone talking down to them.
I don’t think you have the ability to assess comments given you see no issue with patronizing statements but see many with statements negatively reacting to them.
You tried and failed, because as said before, patronizing people is a poor way to give advice. No one will listen to you if you act that way.
If you wanted to condescendingly tell people how to do it, you should become a manager of a McDonald’s or something, where people calling you out is reprimandable. If you’re getting hyper defensive about people telling you that your advice, and other people’s advice, are conveyed in a manner that’s rude, then that’s on you.
I responded like that because the support was, frankly, not given in a very polite manner: talking down to people, and then they responded in a manner that was very erratic, such as claiming unexpectedness and unknowingness to be synonyms, etc.
You “tried to redirect” in an even more passive-aggressive manner, and so I did not respond positively to your asshattery.
That’s okay if you don’t think you are, that’s fine.
I didn’t say it wasn’t an accident, stop trying to put words into people’s mouths. When people act in a manner like that, it IS usually intentional.
I’m telling you because people will call you out on giving advice like that and not respond in a polite manner, and if you keep telling yourself they’re getting “defensive” then that’s just fine, people will keep calling out your bullcrap and you can keep thinking it’s them being hyperdefensive or whatever.
I’m going to pile on the group of posters saying that you can’t expect a random stranger on the internet to hold your hand through the learning process. It would have been awesome if that other tank had elected to help you out, and stuff like that does happen, but at the end of the day, the one responsible for your own performance is you.
I mean I get that to a degree they’re not responsible, but it was literally the first wipe on a boss, and the reaction was an immediate kick. Frankly that’s very uncalled for, and a very quick scapegoating rather than actually assessing things.
And I stated this before but it probably got buried, but I checked the video on how to tank for the boss- it was literally just pull adds off DPS and healers and run them to under the boss to be cleaved for the first stage, and that’s literally what I did as I encountered similar bosses in previous raids.
Did I probably make some mistakes? Probably, but who doesn’t make some here and there?
The whining is OP.
You keep trying to make this about me. It isn’t. I could give a flying eff whether or not you take my advice or not. You’ve adequately demonstrated that you’re the problem. You can fix it or not, I don’t care in the slightest. Either way, I’m out.
And you’re the one who keeps trying to make it about me. It isn’t. I couldn’t give a flying eff whether or not you take my advice or not. You’ve adequately demonstrated that you can’t give advice for crap. You can fix it or not, I don’t care in the slightest. Either way, I’m out.
The player attitudes in LFR are an inevitable product of how the system is designed, i.e. a system with zero barrier to entry with systems built in (vote kick protection, personal loot) to encourage trolling, griefing and poor play.
Being surprised at this outcome is like being surprised that the sun rises in the morning.
I’m more not getting why an experienced player is so rude. Dude literally gains nothing, and would even have to wait for another tank, so it just seems so pointless. It’s not surprising, more meaningless.
Because he can and because there are no consequences for him. After enough times getting kicked he will be protected from further kicks.
In a premade group there is no such protection (assuming you’re not friends with the group leader). Start being “rude” and you’ll get kicked sooner than later, and it will happen every time with no protection.
That…sounds like a very broken system.
OP got vote kicked? Are tanks no longer so rare that we get instaqueues?
I’m thinking about starting to play again; do I need to pick a lesser role?
It is broken, and it has been broken and festering since LFD was introduced in 2010 and LFR in late 2011.
For many people the answer to “why do you behave this way ?” is simply “because I can”.
Ok but people are like this all over the world in hundreds of different scenarios.
Some people are just rude, with no motivation or provocation. Not sure what you don’t get about it, it’s just life; it’s reality.
If you just worry about your own game-play and improvement you will (hopefully) soon not have to worry about the impact others have on you.
Finding external resources for help as an alternative to venting for sympathy for 20hrs would be more beneficial.
I don’t understand why people feel the need. Like you at times.
I mean it was reality to kill each other in the past, doesn’t mean it’s something to accept.
Okay buddy
Interesting view on what you think someone is doing, coolio.