While spec choice would still be meaningful it still reduces how meaningful it is by a considerable degree as it can make hybrid specs designed to fulfill multiple roles basically nonviable. A raid would no longer take a smite priest if the priest could be shadow and holy with 2 specs.
Could you expand a bit on this please?
The wotlk dual spec system still requires players to make a meaningful choice regarding their two specs they’re going to be using.
If the primary argument against dual spec is that it reduces the impact of choosing your spec, but a wotlk dual spec system requires even more thought and planning to choose your two specs, I am not understanding the argument.
We can take arena out of the equation for this argument. I want to focus on if you think the wotlk dual spec system still has meaningful and impactful spec choices, as you can only have two of them at a time and would still have to pay 50g to swap one of them around if you wanted a third option.
Very good point and something I didn’t consider.
Just saying, a lot of guilds/groups already discriminate against hybrid specs but obviously they still get into groups so that doesn’t really matter.
I 100% am OK with arena spec because arena is a laddered, matchmade mini game that is separate from the game and it’s lore and intended immersion process.
If accessibility of PvP is your main concern, this should be solely enough for those who need to be in their most optimal specs.
All of WOTLK dual spec does is afford the many benefits it comes with to all those who will not use it for PvP.
I also don’t think the increase in PvP participation would be measurable or appreciably increased either way.
See, WoW PvP is simply just not that popular, unfortunately.
Even in retail we see very poor PvP numbers (in relation to PvE numbers % wise). WoW is a PvE game and the audience clearly shows it in the activities they flock to in massive majority.
People are simply choosing other outlets for their PvP itch, like MOBAs or shooters, or other team fight games likes Destiny or Apex.
There are simply better designed and well-kept and updated options for PvP accomplishment factor and that’s pretty much where people have gone, leaving very little left for niche areas like WoW PvP.
The solution for PvP participation is probably to put rewards in it that benefit PvE-ers in some way.
However, while this will increase participation, it doesn’t mean everyone doing it even enjoys it, they’d be doing it because they feel forced, so it’s more like an artificial bloat if anything.
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The true advantage of a real hybrid spec is if they do both roles on the same fight, something dual spec does not allow. Switching specs between fights is something that can already be done.
Blizz decided in their effort to produce an “authentic, faithful recreation” to place rating requirements on weapons that would have been great pve items in phase 1.
They also changed the starting team rating from 1500 to 0, which made teams play several games before they even hit the starting rating in og tbc. This also caused teams that would have been earning 400-600 points a week in the og tbc system to only earn 100-200 a week.
I feel forced to grind gold for respecs so I can enjoy pve and pvp. If I was a pvp only player I would still have to do raids for items that are just too good to pass up in pvp. Why would that be ok but if a pve player felt forced to do 10 games of pvp a week that’s “artificial bloat”?
They also have the benefit of not having to go change specs mid raid and cause downtime in the raid and can change their gear before each fight to fulfill the role they will be focusing on more. That is also a benefit of the hybrid builds. Not having to leave the raid to change what role they are filling.
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This is something that is unique to tbc not having dual spec so I don’t really have any argument. You’re 100% right that the hybrid builds wouldn’t really exist in a wow with dual spec.
And no matter how much I dislike hybrid specs, I am not a fan of players gimping themselves to play some meme build, hybrids are something unique to the design decision to keep dual spec out of tbc.
Please don’t roast me for hating on hybrids. If you’re a 95+ parser in your hybrid meme build (zipzo) that’s awesome but the vast majority of people playing those hybrid specs could be doing their job better and helping the raid more if they ran a different spec setup. The content isn’t really that hard anyways so it’s not a big deal.
Feral is the one exception because they have tanking and dps in one build.
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I don’t think your proposed problem is even good enough to need a solution to begin with.
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No, people having more fun in a video game should never be allowed!!!
Then let me have my fun with a dual spec-less TBCC…you can wish for it in TBCC-SoM, in that case, I’ll join you in rooting for the change.
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Have to say this keep up the good work.
Don’t give up Wrath will be here soon an you will get your dual spec.
I’ve been busy all day and come back to an actual circular discussion and I may have skipped the wrong post, but I still haven’t ever seen Redheadchild come to grips with the two differing realities
Redheadchild: “Faithful Recreation”
Blizzard Devs: alliance seal of blood, hvh bgs, no batching, early ssc nerfs, engi belt, mqg removed from arena, hunter macro removed, horde seal of corruption, etc etc etc etc etc
Until he reconciles his statement with actual events, nobody here should entertain a single post from him. It’s just trolling.
#dualspecplz
I don’t see how trying to hold Blizz to the promise even after they’ve bent the rules a few times doesnt make sense.
Just because they did a few changes doesn’t mean we all the sudden don’t care about trying to prevent other poor changes.
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You can’t hold someone to a promise they’ve already broken.
“I promise I won’t jump in the pool”
“sploosh”
Yeah, never happened. This guy promised he wouldn’t, so clearly he never got in the pool. Wait why is he all wet? Must be my imagination.
I’m not claiming its a perfect recreating, but they are using design goal intentions as part of their decision making process.
And while I personally don’t love most of the changes they have made, they had reasons to make them and none of them had a clear cut example of those changes going against the design intention goals of tbc. Dual spec however has a clear NO.
When they say authentic recreation I’m not expecting a carbon copy, I am expecting it to respect the origional games design goal intentions, and thus far they have mostly done so.
Some of the changes are in an area that we know the origional devs very well might have made the changes made. Some are in a gray area where it’s questionable if they would have done some of the changes.
But dual spec or any form of multi spec that removes the consequences changing specs? We have a clear NO for that.
And lastly. Bad changes do not justify more bad changes being made.
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So what you’re saying to be perfectly clear and concise:
#itsafaithfulrecreationexceptforwhereitsnotandblizzardmakingchangesdoesntmeanitsnotafaithfulrecreationevenwhenthechangeshavehugeimplicationsandmakeitnotafaithfulrecreationbecauseblizzardmadethemwithplayerinputitsstillafaithfulrecreationbecauseicanjustifythechangestheyhavealreadymadebysuggestingthattheywerentreallyabigdealbutanyotherchangeswoulddefinitelybeabigdealunlessblizzardmakesmorechangesthentheywontbeabigdealeitherbecauseblizzardmadethem
Did I sum that up correctly?
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Bent what rules? They said from the start that changes were on the table and they’ve made changes, almost like they’re doing exactly what they said.