So the net effect of the biggest change:
OLD: 30 sec cooldown. 15% damage for 6 seconds. 60 energy gained. (3 point talent investment)
NEW: 8 sec cooldown. No damage increase. 40 energy gained at the cost of “significant mana” (6 point talent investment)
Yes I understand that this is more on-demand energy over time (assuming mana supports it - we dont know?), but it just doesn’t feel like a win, especially with double the talent point investment (when points are already at a high premium).
Also… Druid STILL has no hybrid talents (ie. spell/healing power, or attack power conversion from other stats) which is just asinine. Especially when every other hybrid class AND hunter does in some form. Interesting Hybrid/tri-spec builds are actually now LESS viable now than Classic because of the base damage/healing nerfs and the lack of spell power (for feral) or attack power (for resto/balance) access still remaining in place.
15 Likes
They already did, friend.
4 Likes
Paladins don’t. Shamans and hunters do.
Can someone explain to me how this isn’t just the powershifting macro? Like in what way does this differ from spending mana to powershift to gain energy?
3 Likes
Paladins get 100% of intellect as spell power for 3 points in the ret tree.
Shamans get 30% of int as spell power.
They are not the same.
As for druids, they don’t really need that conversion. They gear differently. You don’t aim for intellect or spell damage with a feral build, because you aren’t casting spells like paladins and shamans are.
Yeah sorry was thinking about the AP conversion hunters and shamans get from int. Paladins don’t get that.
Because more of ret’s damage comes from spell sources (righteousness, holy damage from holy strike, consecration, etc) than physical.
This is classic though and Hybrid builds should be a thing and builds expand just beyond end-game PvE (where you hyper focus on one role.)
For example Feral can provide healing support. Resto can provide damage/tanking in a pinch. Tri-specs where you tank damage but use range when you can, etc.
1 Like
You guys were begging for the shifting playstyle… Yikes.
2 Likes
And they can still do that, but the cost of being an exceptional tank or dps in cat/bear form is having less mana, less spell power/healing, and more focused gear. The cost of being an exceptional healer is having a less effective bear/cat form. This is why druid has always been labeled the jack of all trades, master of none.
A ret pally or enhance shaman can’t really become an effective tank or healer with a button press either. A resto shaman or holy/prot paladin can’t become a decent dps with a button press. That’s just how the classes are designed.
Who are “you guys”? Also, you don’t shift for this at all…
1 Like
Unless they reduce mana costs on shapeshifting I have a very bad feeling about full feral in PvP since they’re nuking intellect from our gear
Keep feral gear itemization the same and make Furor the same as in WotLK
1 Like
Yes I get your argument overall, but nothing in the talents supports this specific statement.
I agree with you that from a raiding single-role/focus perspective, everything is generally fine.
But this “jack of all trades” style is exactly what I’m asking for haha. There is very little hybrid spec or tri-spec support at all and everything having worse base damage (and healing?) just compounds the problem even more.
(As an example, Shaman can easily make a cool resto/enhance hybrid build.)
1 Like
Out of the three hybrids druid still fares the best. Feral druid especially. You get tank and melee dps in the same talent tree using mostly the same gear. Neither form uses your mana (sans this new cat talent) meaning you basically get 100% mana regen while ‘casting’ as the default - something other classes have to spend 3-5 talent points for - and you can save that mana to use your heals or utility spells freely.
Paladins get tank and dps in two separate trees, and use their mana for both. Shamans get to “half tank” with no real support for the role, and have to use mana for their melee dps as well. Neither can pull off multi role as well as druid can.
Yeah that is a fair point. Tank / melee DPS hybrid definitely wins for Druid.
Would just be nice to support other types of hybridization (for all hybrids.)
The closest anyone else gets is enh shaman, but it runs into a lot of issues feral doesn’t. Yea, if need be I can swap my 2h for a 1h/shield, put on rockbiter, and try to pick up threat with earth shock, but that’s assuming I even have the mana for it after dealing damage for any significant amount of time, and i still don’t have a taunt or proper mitigation.
A feral druid in cat form can press 1 button, immediately have rage as a resource, vastly increased armor and health, and a taunt, without having to worry about mana at all.
Well For what it’s worth, I do think they should support Shaman tanking and give a taunt. Perhaps some talent that changes Stoneclaw into one or something (just throwing that out off the top of my head.)
Unleash the hybrids!
If you have to switch out of form for more damage than thats an failure of that identity being a cat or bear. You do not see boomkins switching out to cat. I get for saving an wipe or going bear to taunt a boss because an tank went down. Thats cool class fun. Popping into bear for lacerate stacks for cat dps is one of worst thing. That might be an thing in forever. If i am rewarded for leaving my main role form for damage than the design of that form is messed.
Breaking bear and cat would be like shaman tanking. Giving room for an build to breath is better for the game. Trying hold bear and cat back is/was making the idea of a role is worst for everyone trying to minimax.
2 Likes
“Feral” does not discriminate cat/bear