So, in the current state survival hunter is like a ranged hibrid which relies on CC and kite.
In Dragonflight we got a new gameplay for survival hunters, spearhead/MB, a build which relies a lot on melee, i like it, its really cool, but…
Hunter defenses doens’t match all distinct other melee classes.
This becomes evident when we see that warriors will have storm bolt+impending victory, disarm, ignore pain, die by sword, reflect etc…
We have to deal against many disarms/self healing and defenses greater than turtle while spearhead build is not suposed to “kite” that much to fill that hole…
I suggest some kind of leech 15% leech on spearhead? i don’t know
The melee/Mongoose bite gameplay is far from new though… It was how we played in Legion (with a lot of rotation clutter/bloat) and it’s also how we played in BFA and to some extent in SL. It’s just in the recent patch with the tier-set that we’ve completely left it behind, even for ST (just lol).
But yes, they seem to want to focus on a build revolving pretty much only on the MB/MF rotation for ST, and bombs mainly for AoE.
And you are completely right that the CD’s/defensives are just not there for SV. Currently it works ok-ish since you are not a melee class at all, in PvP it’s pretty much kite or die. And with the changes we’ve gotten so far I doubt it will change, only that we won’t really be able to kite on ST build, so I guess it’s the same lame AoE build we have now that will be viable for PvP.
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Thats my point, in the current model we kite in order to deal against greater defensives, but with dragonflight melee model those defensives will not be enough… the “Right-side” gameplay needs some defensive attention.
Exiliration vs Impeding Victory+Disarm+ a stun which has 1/3 intimidation CD.
A fellow hunter made a great thread some days ago comparing what warriors have as a core class against the hunter class. The list was some 20 against barely 10. And the hunters list wasn’t just much shorter the abilities/passives was just laughably weaker.
So yes, I havent used my hunter for any PvP in years and I sure as sheet won’t for DF unless they make drastic changes.
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Meh, we have binding shackle, that’ll fix it …
This is part of why I have been suggesting a version of Spearhead and supporting talents that can focus on building up a powerful Raptor Strike from a safe distance, Harpoon in to land the Raptor Strike and apply a heavy bleed, and then get back to a safe distance while building up the next powerful Raptor Strike and bleed.
Spearhead doesn’t look like it will work well with Mongoose Bite since you’ll likely be clipping your bleeds. In order for the talent to work, you need some time between strikes to allow the bleed to occur, otherwise you’re just throwing away damage.
I’ve also suggested a version of Coordinated Assault that would allow Mongoose Bite to shine, but like Mongoose Bite in general, it’s a concept that lends itself more to PVE than PVP.
Spearhead vs Coordinated Assault - Classes / Hunter - World of Warcraft Forums (blizzard.com)
This is against all purpose of spearhead, the problem is melee hunter defensives, make it a ranged its not good.
How so? The only improvement to Raptor Strike or Mongoose Bite from Spearhead is that they apply an additional 35% damage as a bleed on the target for 4 seconds. If you’re Striking or Biting more often than every 4 seconds, you’re just clipping the bleed.
Meanwhile, your pet deals 25% increased damage and Kill Command has a 20% increased chance to reset. Combine this with Tip of the Spear which makes Kill Command increase the damage of your next Raptor Strike / Mongoose Bite.
The ideal approach would be to Kill Command 3 times to maximize Tip of the Spear, pop Spearhead, and then land your beefed up Raptor Strike / Mongoose Bite. After this, you have no reason to Raptor Strike or Mongoose Bite again for 4 seconds, otherwise you will overwrite your bleed with a weaker bleed.
With a 4 second window of not wanting to use your melee strike, that’s a 4 second window that you have no reason whatsoever to be in melee range of a melee enemy with better defenses and burst. Your white hits simply will not be worth the damage you would suffer for the effort.
Instead of taking the beating, get back out, let your beefed up pet do some work and build up your next Raptor Strike / Mongoose Bite.
Did we get any confirmation that the dot from spearhead stacks or not yet?
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i want to know that aswell
I was hoping/assuming the spearhead dot would stack like the current shrapnel bomb. I guess we will see, it’s still early alpha.
TotS already hits hard at 3stacks though. So it already supports the hit and run hybrid surv style. Ppl are looking at SH as a more melee version of surv. Honesty, maybe they should make a passive.
Something like;
-increases melee dmg and pet dmg by x.
-decreases by taken by x.
Rename it “Live by the spear” (i hear it’s very well liked and popular name lol…) and make SH a cd that increases dmg of you and your pet if your hitting the same target.
If Spearhead doesnt stack bleeds then its a worthless CD and shouldnt be picked lol simple as that.
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They shouldn’t be. Survival is full of tooltips that mention effects that stack. Spearhead isn’t one of them.
It’s simple enough to build a melee oriented Mongoose Bite, however.
Coordinated Assault - You and your pet charge your enemy, striking them for physical damage. You and your pet’s bond is then strengthened for 20 seconds, causing your pet’s Basic Attack to empower your next spell cast:
Mongoose Bite: Focus cost reduced by 5.
Then replace Deadly Duo with the following:
Coordinated Kill - Mongoose Bite generates 5 / 10 Focus for your pet during Coordinated Assault.
With each Mongoose Bite during Coordinated Assault, you would generate 10 Focus (assuming 2 points in Coordinated Kill) for your pet. In turn, with each Basic Attack from your pet, which it can use every 3 seconds, your Mongoose Bite would only cost 25 Focus.
The amount of Focus generated for your pet and the Focus cost reduction of Mongoose Bite could be adjusted as needed, but the concept is simply to allow the player to more quickly reach that 5 stack of Mongoose Fury and to sustain that increased damage for the duration of Coordinated Assault.
Idk if I would go as far to call it “worthless” but it would def. take some of the shine off if the dot from spearhead did not stack.
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Heres to hoping that blizz makes the right design decision and give it the ignite treatment.
Well, its my concern because [Pouch of Razor Fragments] doens’t stacks.
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I think thats a frequency issue. Kill shot should not frequently be up enough to clip the bleed that often.
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Exactly, the fact that Pouch of Razor Fragments doens’t stacks its only bearable because its frequency. Yet if you proc 2 times and the first one is crit you lost the first crit dot.
Yeah i can see how that would be unrewarding. I highly doubt they are going to let Spearhead function the same way. Especially given the fast pace nature of MB and the fact that it is not on crits but just raw mongoose bite/raptor strike hits.