Now that Doomguard is not worth using, do we even put it on the action bars?
Why cant doomguard just be added to the class tree as a 5 min, class wide dps cd? It would be tuned significant enough to make a difference but not overwhelm spec identity. Then make sure its tuned for pvp, which would be big bc i dont even think they can use it.
Lastly, it gives the opportunity for multiple talents to grow off of doomguard to perhaps allow for the old version to be available, or aoe version, etc… seems like its a win/win for everyone.
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Classic Blizzard; “fun detected”.
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Fun for blizz = bad returns.
Agreed. Doomguard should be used as a big damage CD. Could be that it sacrifices our current demon to summon it and when the timer ends for it, our sacrificed demon spawns back with their signature ability. Could be some cool ways to make this work well. Talents that allow us to summon it without said sacrifice at the cost of it’s dps or something. I hate that ritual of doom exists but there’s legit no reason to ever use it.
Ooh, imagine instead of soul conduit capstone in our class tree, it was ritual of doom and did this. And soul conduit could finally just be baseline because why it’s not is beyond me.
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I honestly miss the time when the doomguard was a permanent pet.
I wish demonology class fantasy was summoning fewer but powerful demons instead of demon zoo.
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I just want doomguard to be incorporated into our playstyle since it seems like everytime they make him viable some beta complains and they nerf him.
I dont think it should replace already summoned pets or anything of the nature. It sould just be an exclusive dps cd where you hit it and doomguard comes. Keep it simple.
It would maintain the concept of it being such a powerful demon it needs a sacrifice, it could be made much more impactful this way.
Yes, lorewise that would be quite excellent. However, realistically, blizz only implements things that are simple, easy to balance, and require the least amount of man hours as humanly possible.
Therefore, sacrificing another demon for doomguard to only have it reemerge after hes gone requires significant man hours and tuning. Blizz is highly unlikely to implement such a change. In fact, just to get doomguard on the class tree as a simple dps cd is a massive mountain that although many of us are willing to climb, blizz is highly unlikely to even look at, let alone implement.
Honestly, i am just trying to get it so doomguard can see consistent use and a solid position in the tree before blizz gets a nac and deletes him.
This. Would. Be. Amazing.
Doomguards are the OG big bads of the Legion and anything demonic, we deserve them.
And now for the Debbie Downer…
When Soulkeeper was one of the capstone talents on the warlock class tree during DF, I remember seeing quite a lot of disdain to that talent simply for being a “press and forget” DPS button - which kind of seems this would be too.
The other roadblock I see keeping this from becoming a reality is simply the developer(s) in charge of warlocks talents - they seem to want NO throughtput/DPS talents on the Class tree - unless it has no fantasy/visual appeal whatsoever (seriously, out of all 13 class talent trees, warlocks have the MOST boring and unmotivated throughput talents out of all of them)
I would absolutely love it if they made doomguards a class-wide cooldown, but it seems the devs have different plans (although I could be wrong, actually yeah, someone please prove me wrong - I want this doomguard, please)
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Thats bc the lock devs hate their own class.
Also, as a pure dps class, there should be tons of throughout talents in our class tree.
Three, it can be modified, but make it accessible to all specs in all situations is a large necessary step.
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Yeah they say they don’t want any throughput on a class tree and yet they’re inconsistent with this, as DK has Abom limb in theirs. I don’t like the hypocritical approach they use as a scapegoat in this case. I had the same issue with their response as to why Ascendance wasn’t in the class tree for Shaman. Same problem. Anything that is class wide and in a talent tree should be in the class tree, throughput/DPS or not.
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Exactly.
Ascendence for shamans, limbs for dk, dg for locks, cotw for hunters, crusade for pallys. Its rly not hard to tune things anymore now that they can seperate things. There is rly no other excuse other than they are lazy and cheap.
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I wouldn’t say lazy and cheap. We don’t actually know the inner workings about how they go about making these decisions, but I’m sure they do take good criticism seriously. I think it’s more of a matter of who they’re listening to and when. Someone will eventually say, “Hey, the players really want to see this” and it’ll be implemented in some way. I think they feel that Pact of Ered’ruin is that answer, but that there’s a disconnect somewhere.
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I honestly think it falls upon those with the sqeekest wheel. The 1%, world firsts, etc. If locks at that level dont want dg as a class wide cd, it is not going to happen, no matter what us pleebs state are good changes.
I cant think of a good reason why any lock pvper wouldnt want a dg cd. Short of los issues, they dont even get to use him so im assuming just having that extra dmg output would be benefitual.
Speaking of dmg output, they can always make him more inclusive to each spec.
Have one node provide the following:
Aff: dg dmg is increased by each dot on the target.
Demo: dg contributes to mainmans demon dmg increase count
Destro: each time dg does dmg, the lock gains .25 soul shard and empowers your imp to do 200% more dmg.
Then provide an aoe node
Aff: dg hits every target that is afflicated with corruption/wither and increases dot duration by 2 sec.
Demo: dg hits all targets within 10 yrds of your felguard (decreased after 8 targets), and either has a 25% chance of making your hand free w/ 3 shards or summons an imp.
Destro: dg empowers your imp, allowing them to hit all targets afflicted by your immolate for 200% dmg and those additional bolts contibute .15 a soul shard.
You could also do something like this if you dont want to use the dg as a dps cd with an additional node:
You infuse the essense of the dg into your primary cd (darkglare/big man/infernal), gaining the following benefits:
Aff: darkglare ascends to a higher form which casts a shadow void under all targets with dots on them, causing the dots to burst dealing x amount of aoe dmg and increasing their duration. During this time, shadows embrace stacks to 10 instead of 4 and shadow bolt does 50% more dmg.
Demo: big man gets chained to a demon from the depths who leaps into battle, shadow cleaving all targets in a 10 yrd radius and causing all pets to do 50% more dmg. The demon remains chained to big man, causing his attacks to be empowered hitting all targets in the 10 yrd radius and has a 20% chance to call a dog for free.
Destro: infernal becomes unstable with the cocation of shadow and fire magic, increasing its aoe immolation dmg by 200%, and causing little infernals to break off every 2seconds which also immolate. After 3 seconds, these small infernals burst, causing aoe dmg and increasing fire and shadow dmg done to the targets hit by 75%. Percentage increased if only 1 target hit.
I know these are a bit over the top, but the point i am making is that players do not want a hit and forget. However, they do want an visually exciting and incorporated cd such as i expressed above. With dg on the class tree and the provided additional nodes, players can choose the base dg, the dg as an extra cd, or dg as a cd incorporated into their already established rotation. Thats the beauty of choice.
The goal of this is to prevent dg from being deleted and finding a solid home for him.
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There’s like more than half the dps with throughput talents and damage CDs.
I kinda wish demo had conditions to when the more they used hand of guldan the more powerful and higher tiers the demons would be. Or that the tyrant would empower hand of guldan / demonbolt.
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I’d like a talent that would empower our hand of Gul’dan to summon or empower Doom Guards. Maybe instead of three imps, a 3 shard HoG would summon a larger Doom Guard. Or, every shard spent during DG increases his damage and size. During Tyrant windows imagine popping this CD with full Shards and 4 DB procs and just summoning an army of DGs or making 1 raid boss sized DG who absolutely slaps. I guess that’s what Tyrant has been and what he used to be more-so, and they’ve kind of left that sort of design philosophy behind.
But either way, I agree that DG as a CD should absolutely be a thing and that during the DG CD, something in our kit is empowered. Even if it’s something like our shadowbolts turning into doom bolts, granting us 2 or 3 shards per cast, or our 3 shard HoGs summoning stronger demons like the Gul’dan fight in Nighthold. Anything like this would be fun and visually pleasing.
Yeah sounds really cool. Really a 3 shard hand of guldan should do a lot than just summon 3 imps.
Even the name of the ability sounds like it should do something big.
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Yes, those sound cool, but are talking about dg as a cd. I mean, yea, demo dmg is totally cd dependent.
I think dg should complement already established systems, but add a level of excitement into the rotation. I agree, at the base levels, many of the spells especially for demo need to be enhanced, yet i think dg could contribute to that, while not taking away from the traditional nature of the spec.
If dg is infused with tyrant, for demo example, perhaps it enhances the hand of guldan to, instead of summoning imps, pulls up the shadow from beneath its targets, allowing demons of all sorts to come up from the shadows and does x amount of aoe shadow dmg. However it has a 15 sec cd but with 2 charges. The niche about it is that all the demons that get called up, no matter size or type, last 30 secs and ARE implodable and do dmg relatable to their size.
Now that is a hand of guldan to be proud of, yet, completely over the top for such a rotational spell.