I just can’t understand the emphasis on throw glaive and disengaging from combat for havoc.
I think I’d prefer momentum meant something else entirely. If you’ll indulge me I’d like to share my idea for a rework.
- Activate momentum (new ability)
- Use chaos strike or blade dance
2a) Chaos strike triggers single target momentum sequence: A
Gain points for every chaos strike used within the next (x) seconds (critical hits give more points). At the end of the duration, perform an agile sequence of strikes (Needs to look really flashy!) granting haste and empowering your auto attacks with fel energy for (x) seconds.
2b) Blade dance triggers the aoe/cleave momentum sequence:
Gain points for every damage instance of sigil of flame, immolation aura, and fel rush within the next (x) seconds. At the end of the duration, perform a flurry of sweeping glaive strikes dealing aoe damage (Needs to look really flashy!) granting mastery and causing glaives to spin around you dealing aoe chaos damage for (x) seconds.
I realize this isn’t perfect. If you can look past the exact example and think about this thematically as a series of calculated and well timed abilities ending in a flash of glaive strikes and fel energy.
I’m interested in your ideas to make combat engaging in a fluid way.
I don’t completely dislike the concept. I’d just like to see something that is a little more interactive and possibly has a cool visual.
For example, I suggested something that causes an interaction that not only has a fun visual but interacts with your abilities in a way that isn’t just “use this ability to gain (x)% damage boost”.
I think DH has a lot of identity. They’re the only class in the game that can use glaives. They use mobility as part of their rotation/kit. They’re huge demons part of the time.
This isn’t a good identity. Mobility for damage has been a failed concept with every class that it’s been tried on, including DH.
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I don’t even think removing movement based damage is necessary. It could be baked in with smaller numbers and a longer duration similar to a maintenance buff.
So many options to make the class feel like staying in melee range had a purpose too. I’d love to see some better interaction with the abilities than push button get bonus damage for a very short duration.
I never said it was universally loved or not divisive. It is what Blizzard wants though and it is unlikely to change. I play vengeance exclusively since S1 of DF because I no longer enjoy havoc. That said, their movement being used for damage is part of their identity.
No it’s not. Mementum has always been a fringe, mostly hated playstyle since DH inception. It wasn’t until DF that it was forced on the spec by a horrible dev (Realz) who might not even be a WoW dev anymore.
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Yeah, you’re not wrong but when they added the DF talent tree, and rework in S2, it was part of their design to make movement their identity. I’ve mained DH since day 1 Legion. I don’t like DF havoc but tons of players who jumped on in DF do. So its whatever to me. VDH is fun.
No they don’t. Any metric we can see shows most hate it. And the fact that the devs felt the need to add inertia as a way to try and get more people to play the mementum talents proves it even further.
zZz
Fel Rush has always done damage, even if not used rotationally. And Unbound Chaos in Shadowlands simmed better than Trail of Ruin. Inertia was added as an alternative to Momentum. Turning Vengeful Retreat into a way to buff yourself or generate fury too. It is clear they want DH to have their identity as movement during combat.
Any time I used to bring up how much I disliked Momentum, people on here would come out of the woodwork to say havoc is no longer a 3 button spec and that they liked the changes. Maybe things changed here, idk. But my comments about Blizzard steering havoc into being a spec that moves as their identity stands.
Okay so I’m thinking keep the momentum as is and create some sort of fluid fun interactive sequence of abilities that create the fantasy of moving around a lot but you can stay stationary while doing it. Make it do a little less damage or make it a little complicated and do equal/greater damage.
Let it be a choice. I don’t like throwing glaives or feeling cornered into % damage buffs from mobility. I think it’s a cop-out and lazy design.
A “fringe, mostly hated playstyle” except by everyone that was hyped about it going into Legion and spamming the forums about how great it’d be. A “mostly hated playstyle” except it has more players now than in prior expansions.
Except the only metric we actually have to measure this is playerbase size and there’s more people playing Intertia Havoc now than there’s ever been in the other versions of Havoc that you’re preferential to. And that holds true even when we compare to tiers where Havoc performed better than it does now.
You & your buddies not liking Momentum != everyone not liking Momentum. You not liking Momentum also does not mean that movement as damage hasn’t been a core part of Havoc’s identity since day 1 of Legion, because it has.
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It’s just… hey push a button you typically use for another purpose and get a large damage buff but only for 4 seconds. Doesn’t seem so rewarding. I lost globals and auto attacks and the subsequent resource generation and it goes against the melee I’ve been conditioned to play since this game existed.
So does charge and feral lunge.
It was so loved that everyone played Demonic instead in BfA even though Mementum simmed better.
No, we can see feedback anywhere that allows public posting and it’s always massively opposed to Mementum.
Because it’s a mandatory talent, not because people like it. Try again.
Movement for damage has never been a core part of DH identity. Having strong mobility is a core to this class’s identity, and having our mobility cannibalized to turn it into damage is antithetical to that identity.
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no movement andy speaking for the majority of dh players again, theres 24 other dps specs that dont play with movement, play those instead
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So you’re the person that goes into every class forum and comment thread and tells people to reroll fury warrior if they don’t like the current design of their class.
No.
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I enjoy how you ignored everything else that followed after what I said.
zZz
You can say whatever you want that doesn’t make you right. We’re just going to go in circles so it is quite boring to speak to you.
It is quite clear that Blizzard wants movement to be part of their identity and I would be very surprised if that changes in the future. Talents like Initiative, Unbound Chaos, Momentum and Inertia are here to stay.
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It’s clear that the playerbase doesn’t. Which is why it will change. Pushing the mementum talents was a failed experiment by a bad dev for a whole 1 expansion.
Movement for damage being a core part of DH identity is empirically false. The devs even had to admit it themselves during DF beta when they removed momentum as a capstone due to the mass hatred of the playstyle. As I recall, they specifically stated they were doing so because of how controversial the movement playstyle was after receiving all the negative feedback around it.
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