here is some math for comparison
- locks soul leech assuming 8k dps in 385 gear is something below 1k per second so lets round up to 1k (and this assumes you can do 8k dps btw)
- locks fel armor is rounded up to another 1k since we are getting a 20 percent hp buff overall with both talents which puts you at 180k ish hp which in turn makes fel armor 900 per second
- locks armor reduc and hp buff from talent are equal to current spriests reduc/hp bonus with fort/shadow form
- that means every 6 seconds you absorb 12k damage but also assuming you do REALLY high dps (which you won't being trained you need something like 12k dps). by comparison spriests absorb 13k every 6 seconds
you just have to ask shadow priests what happens when they are not playing insanity pvp talent. Basically you are unhealable
TLDR - the math on lock changes puts warlocks defensively WAY BELOW current shadow priests defensive ability without use of the insanity talent, life swap, vamp embrace, and disperse. It's literally idiotic to assume this change would be enough knowing what is known about spriests atm
1 Like
What... we do fine vs casters.. and 22-24% armor will be awesome ontop of extra hp.... sucks its going to be a talent but still great.
10/30/2018 02:53 PMPosted by EpĂcburnWhat... we do fine vs casters.. and 22-24% armor will be awesome ontop of extra hp.... sucks its going to be a talent but still great.
i just gave you the math. it will not be great. the demon armor buff as a friend reported to me is literally 10 percent more damage reduc vs physical
the math I just gave you proves warlocks are equal to shadow priests in tanking ability and if you played Spriest this expac without the insanity talent, you know that you can't actually live without it for very long and thats with life swap, with shields, vamp embrace, disperse
how is this great for locks? it isn't a wait and see moment, they are literally going to be EXACTLY the same as spriests atm which only live due to a cheesy trait. have you ever seen an spriest opened on by rmp/rmpala? he has to disperse opener instantly. have you ever seen spriest vs melee cleave? they storm bolt you before your pet can generate enough insanity and force cooldowns in that said stormbolt
demon armor is 15% health if im not mistaken and we're ALSO getting another passive 10% health buff for all 3 specs baseline, and a new trait that makes fear give free soul leech.
I don't have a valid pvp opinion cus I don't do it, but we're definitely getting more than just what you mentioned. If you're going to look at survivability as a whole you need to look at the big picture and all of the changes. ID shifting over to agony is better for pvp too since curse removal is less common than magic removal
I think destro could probably do with something else, but aff got a good break
I don't have a valid pvp opinion cus I don't do it, but we're definitely getting more than just what you mentioned. If you're going to look at survivability as a whole you need to look at the big picture and all of the changes. ID shifting over to agony is better for pvp too since curse removal is less common than magic removal
I think destro could probably do with something else, but aff got a good break
10/30/2018 03:28 PMPosted by Haunterdemon armor is 15% health if im not mistaken and we're ALSO getting another passive 10% health buff for all 3 specs baseline, and a new trait that makes fear give free soul leech.
I don't have a valid pvp opinion cus I don't do it, but we're definitely getting more than just what you mentioned. If you're going to look at survivability as a whole you need to look at the big picture and all of the changes. ID shifting over to agony is better for pvp too since curse removal is less common than magic removal
I think destro could probably do with something else, but aff got a good break
they are halving the stacks for ID which was needed i suppose. also its only 10 percent hp and I accounted for the math of the hp buff. Fort is equal to demon armor (both 10 percent)
and then i did the math for leech and fel armor
fear is one of the worst cc's in the game. tremor, dispell, war rage, wotf. it breaks on damage so you have to choose dotting someone or fearing them. also tripple fearing healers is hard on locks so dont expect that AND you want us to do less damage to gain some leechin a wonky way when they tied our defensive ability into our dps
i am looking at all the changes. i even did the math
1 min wall plz!10/30/2018 03:28 PMPosted by Haunter
I think destro could probably do with something else, but aff got a good break
Seriously tho, give it back ):<
The problem with our survivability was never about HP or damage reduction.
Its about the lack of tools.
We have no tools. None. We're just punching bags.
Its about the lack of tools.
We have no tools. None. We're just punching bags.
Was grimoire of sacrifice talent and dark pact taken into the equation?
Let's not forget that demon armor returns as a pvp talent.
Not defending, more tools and survivability options the better.... But with these changes, of only they buffed the heal obtained from drain life, we should be good.
Laying dots and not surviving long enough to see them tick is a burden
Let's not forget that demon armor returns as a pvp talent.
Not defending, more tools and survivability options the better.... But with these changes, of only they buffed the heal obtained from drain life, we should be good.
Laying dots and not surviving long enough to see them tick is a burden
10/30/2018 03:28 PMPosted by Haunterdemon armor is 15% health if im not mistaken and we're ALSO getting another passive 10% health buff for all 3 specs baseline, and a new trait that makes fear give free soul leech.
I don't have a valid pvp opinion cus I don't do it, but we're definitely getting more than just what you mentioned. If you're going to look at survivability as a whole you need to look at the big picture and all of the changes. ID shifting over to agony is better for pvp too since curse removal is less common than magic removal
I think destro could probably do with something else, but aff got a good break
We’re gettig a trait that makes fear give free soul leech? That’s kinda neat I guess. Did they specify how much?
I'm not sure if the health bonus will actually help at all because of the scaling in pvp. We're gonna get hit for the same percentage we are getting right now.
10/30/2018 06:06 PMPosted by DemoniclilyI'm not sure if the health bonus will actually help at all because of the scaling in pvp. We're gonna get hit for the same percentage we are getting right now.
I’m super concerned about this. Does more HP even matter when everything is on a percentage system?
10/30/2018 05:31 PMPosted by MenemiesWe’re gettig a trait that makes fear give free soul leech? That’s kinda neat I guess. Did they specify how much?
Well it used to make fear steal health but apparently that was a bit too much so now instead of stealing health it does that. I don't know exactly how much it steals but the info for it is on mmo-champ
10/30/2018 03:28 PMPosted by Haunterdemon armor is 15% health if im not mistaken and we're
No, it was changed to 10%.
ALSO getting another passive 10% health buff for all 3 specs baseline,
No, it's 10% bonus stam. Its not a flat 10% HP buff as it does not affect base HP at all.
10/30/2018 02:53 PMPosted by EpĂcburnWhat... we do fine vs casters.. and 22-24% armor will be awesome ontop of extra hp.... sucks its going to be a talent but still great.
https://clips.twitch.tv/SecretiveAthleticClamStrawBeary
Oh look.. Thugonomicz agrees.
Insane right.
10/30/2018 03:33 PMPosted by Çhriszz10/30/2018 03:28 PMPosted by Haunterdemon armor is 15% health if im not mistaken and we're ALSO getting another passive 10% health buff for all 3 specs baseline, and a new trait that makes fear give free soul leech.
I don't have a valid pvp opinion cus I don't do it, but we're definitely getting more than just what you mentioned. If you're going to look at survivability as a whole you need to look at the big picture and all of the changes. ID shifting over to agony is better for pvp too since curse removal is less common than magic removal
I think destro could probably do with something else, but aff got a good break
they are halving the stacks for ID which was needed i suppose. also its only 10 percent hp and I accounted for the math of the hp buff. Fort is equal to demon armor (both 10 percent)
and then i did the math for leech and fel armor
fear is one of the worst cc's in the game. tremor, dispell, war rage, wotf. it breaks on damage so you have to choose dotting someone or fearing them. also tripple fearing healers is hard on locks so dont expect that AND you want us to do less damage to gain some leechin a wonky way when they tied our defensive ability into our dps
i am looking at all the changes. i even did the math
You could try a heterosexual spec like demo then you can fear without worry of dot damage breaking your fears.
ID nerf, wtf. Literally the only way Affliction was able to queue
These definitely aren't the buffs we asked for or needed, but they are buffs I guess..
I really wanted demonic portal to be baseline so we could have some instant cc like every other class in the game, but I guess that's out of the question. Pretty one dimensional feeling playstyle being a tab dot bot without any way to really help setup kills.
Feels bad to have blizzard rework Dk honor talents, shadow priests, marksman hunters, and elemental shamans (with designated blue posts) while warlocks get a lazy +10% stam buff and +10% stam/armor PvP talent shlopped on and deemed "fixed".
I really wanted demonic portal to be baseline so we could have some instant cc like every other class in the game, but I guess that's out of the question. Pretty one dimensional feeling playstyle being a tab dot bot without any way to really help setup kills.
Feels bad to have blizzard rework Dk honor talents, shadow priests, marksman hunters, and elemental shamans (with designated blue posts) while warlocks get a lazy +10% stam buff and +10% stam/armor PvP talent shlopped on and deemed "fixed".
I also fear that health does nothing for us. If only blizzard would explain their wonky af system.10/30/2018 06:15 PMPosted by Ramrodjones10/30/2018 06:06 PMPosted by DemoniclilyI'm not sure if the health bonus will actually help at all because of the scaling in pvp. We're gonna get hit for the same percentage we are getting right now.
I’m super concerned about this. Does more HP even matter when everything is on a percentage system?
So keep in mind my math could be real wrong but this is what I think we will see -
The only thing that health increases don't help with is going to be against moves that do a % of health based damage - 5% of 150k and 5% of 181,500k
150k (8.0) ---------181,500k (DA+DE)---------235,950k (Grimsac Void-Walker 30%)
7.5k ----------------9.075k ------------------------11,797k
142,500k ----------172,425k----------------------224,152k
The buffs leave us with more health after the attack increasing our survival by a specific amount of time, based of overall incoming damage and type
This napkin math does not factor in the armor increase
its a buff for locks - I can see it being rough for healers that don't have a heal that's a % of life heal - AKA the brand new 65% health heal that Holy priests are getting 8.1
The only thing that health increases don't help with is going to be against moves that do a % of health based damage - 5% of 150k and 5% of 181,500k
150k (8.0) ---------181,500k (DA+DE)---------235,950k (Grimsac Void-Walker 30%)
7.5k ----------------9.075k ------------------------11,797k
142,500k ----------172,425k----------------------224,152k
The buffs leave us with more health after the attack increasing our survival by a specific amount of time, based of overall incoming damage and type
This napkin math does not factor in the armor increase
its a buff for locks - I can see it being rough for healers that don't have a heal that's a % of life heal - AKA the brand new 65% health heal that Holy priests are getting 8.1
10/30/2018 08:15 PMPosted by KagthulNo, it's 10% bonus stam. Its not a flat 10% HP buff as it does not affect base HP at all.
the tooltip doesn't say anything about 'bonus' stam, it says 'stamina increased by 10%', and it's not unsafe to assume it works the same way as imp Blood Pact, which does in fact increase our base stamina (you can confirm this by taking off all of your stamina gear and summoning your imp, your hp will increase from 20k to 21k, and your base stamina from 1001 to 1051.) and base stamina has been the only factor in determining baseline hp for quite a while.
So effectively its 10% health.