or the game is 20 years old and the people that were in junior high school-college age when the game came out just dont have oodles of carefree time anymore to be spending 10+ hours a week raiding
Not even championing for the existence of those two stats to come back. Are WoW players really conditioned to think that bringing back any system involves bringing back the bad parts as well?
Just my personal experience here but I’ve never once found M+ fun when I did it using the LFG. When I had friends to do it with it was some of the most enjoyable experiences I had in WoW. Even now I would probably enjoy it if I had a group to play with regardless of difficulty.
Delves work for me because I don’t have friends who play currently and it satisfies my content cravings while giving me slightly higher loot to chase. As I get older I’m even less inclined to spend my limited time in that toxic waste pit known as LFG.
Just don’t play it? Just because you have a thought doesn’t mean you have to voice it.
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i’d probably quit sadly, that’s what’s been driving me away from FF14 year over year, the repeated dumbing down and homogenizing everything within it to fit in a nice little bow that no one can deviate from
I want the game to succeed, i want players who struggle to have fun, i just want that nice balancing point where you can succeed reasonably well as a lower end player without actively removing any level of finesse or optimization from the high end, if we can strike that i’ll be the happiest i’ve ever been ab the game
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delves are good, but they arent that fun lol. i hope it doesnt replace anything.
plus no ones talking abt raids, theyre talking abt m+ lol. that may take a step
if they dont do something lol.
I feel like the issue is loot drops and RNG. For example, My monk raids every week and I’ve looted next to nothing. My vaults have been bad every week. I made a DH and he is 2 items away from having hero gear in every slot and has not stepped foot in a raid. All his gear is from map drops and great RNG.
The loot system needs some from of adjustments. I don’t know what that should look like honestly. I feel like I just wasted my time raiding when I can get the same lvl gear from delves and convert to get the 4 piece.
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Yeah there used to be a thing called tokens but they were seen to be bad for some reason
Counterargument, transmogs.
LFR gets some good colorations.
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Idk if its a fault of the community the game has taken this course.
To me its basically akin to a normal product cycle.
In the begining it was amazing seeing ourselves in a digital avatar playing with others around the country, or world. The gameay was fluid, a group dungeons and raids were a brand new experience.
Some things like the world, art, and I’d argue combat have lasted beyond what a game normaly would, but i think overall, people have had their fill of group play considering its riddled with toxic people.
The experience is just not worth the hassle and reward. Enter delves.
Making your own groups is still something that all players have the ability to do. If people like to see a change in something then why not take action to make it happen for yourself.
Agreed. LFR teaches bad habits. Much better to add a full Follower mode for raids. That way people can “see” the raid and they don’t have garbage LFR habits formed onto them before they go on to join a raid group.
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I still like raiding, delves are not very fun.
Me thinks Delves will get a huge reward nerf on S2 
I also went to the Turkey Trot for Thanksgiving last year and it took me 3 hours and 14 minutes to finish and they gave me a blue ribbon. It was a race and I’m a winner.
I’m telling you why that system existed to start with, which was because of the bad parts. Because hit and expertise existed and had to be at certain levels with anything past those levels being a waste, reforging was necessary. In today’s game it’s not necessary at all. Every stat you get today will be of some value, with some being of course more help than others. Is it going to be perfect, of course not. However what I find really telling is that for the general WoW populace they treat anything that’s not BiS as though it’s trash when it most certainly isn’t.
When running as frost, generally I want crit and haste as my 2 big ones. If I get a piece that’s say haste and versatility, it’s not going to kill me to equip that piece. Yet from the way people complain about every little thing, you would think it’s the end of the world for me to do that. To which I would maintain that if someone’s build is being made or broken by one piece of gear that doesn’t have BiS combination, their build deserves to be broken. Now would it be convenient to have reforging again so I could move some of that versatility into crit, sure it would. However it’s by no means needed.
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Let me get this straight, people whine about how delves might potentially replace raiding and how people are being tools and everyone is being shoved to single player. So instead of addressing the faults in LFR, your solution is to remove it and push everyone towards single player content by making it a “follower” raid. I just… make it make sense.
I’m guessing thats a server issue since i have never had to wait more than 15 minutes. The gogogo issue is systemic to every mode with a pug. I have no problem with a follower/story mode but i also have no problems with lfr that i don’t also have with other modes.
That’s certainly one way to interpret what I said. If you perhaps read what I said again, you’d realize that my complaint is that LFR is a terrible introduction to group content that imparts nothing but bad habits to people who play it, which they then take to ACTUAL group content. Which makes group content worse for everyone overall.
So yes. Remove LFR. People should be learning raiding in environments where they can be held accountable for their actions. There will be less toxicity overall that way.
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They do. That’s why you see dozens of Tankless runs up on the Group Finder at any given time.