Moreover, it’s ruined almost every other part of the game.
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It hasn’t, but keep beatin’ that drum.
I suppose lol. I used to be that way. Now i’m wanting actual end game content if i’m doing all the work. A raid isn’t enough imo.
Oh, ok well I guess I’ll ignore all the evidence and just take your word for it.
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This analogy kinda falls apart when you consider that most of the top MDI teams are made up of players who also participate in the WFR.
I’m okay with throwing vulperas in there too.
Claiming evidence and not showing the evidence makes me think you don’t really have evidence and are about to tell me to “do my own research.” Go get your vaccine, Charlie.
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The only reasons anyone aggressively hates m+ is because it screws with their head cannon about being a good player. It’s a defense mechanism to protect the core “self”.
They can rationalize not being good in pvp, because of class/spec/group-think or whatever.
They can rationalize not doing mythic raid because of the time commitment and social stigma.
But m+ is so approachable. So available to everyone who wants to do it. The only reason NOT to do it is either 1) you don’t like it or 2) you can’t execute.
What gets me is that the group of people who just don’t like m+ so aggressively and campaign for its removal. The same kind of anti-diversity thinking that’s been the source of all the worlds problems for 250 thousand years.
Don’t like it, don’t do it. Easy, 2 step solution to a happier life.
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So what would be endgame content to you? I am a little confused. If it’s not raiding, and not pvp, and not M+… what is it?
I literally typed this hours ago and apparently didn’t post it?
I apologize maybe because I don’t do mythic dungeons enough. What toxic atmosphere are you talking about? Could you give some examples of how it is being toxic? I am not trying to be confrontational here. Just coming onto the forums and saying Remove it because it’s Toxic without showing how isn’t going to convince Blizzard to look into the so-called toxic atmosphere. Let alone remove it from the game. So please provide an example of what you have seen heard or experienced yourself.
Also, How is a so-called toxic atmosphere going to prevent new players from doing group content? PvP I think we can all agree just from the nature of competitiveness could be from some people’s perspective a very highly toxic atmosphere. Yet, I see first-timers come into PvP all the time and return just because of the excitement they get from killing a fellow player. Their words not mine. I do PvP as a stress relief. So could you further explain how this would prevent a new player from doing group content?
the mythic plus mentality has seeped into the casual content and every where else in the game. pull a room, wipe, quit
go go go, attack people for low numbers etc
Are you ever going to accept that this happened before you even started playing the game and has nothing to do with M+? I mean I get initially thinking that because you didn’t have the game experience… but at some point you really have to accept that your opinion was drawn from faulty knowledge.
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That is typical wow. That has been since Vanilla. This is why Blizzard instituted the Dungeon Deserter penality.
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Or don’t play it?
I don’t like olives.
I don’t ask grocery stores to stop selling them…
Years before M+ existed.
In legion I could solo a plus 2 well within the timer. Methinks the problem is you. 
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Totally agree.
I dont mind a game mode but its essentially the same 8 dungeons we launched with 2 years ago. Its just reusing your old content instead of coming out with new stuff. Its as exciting as dungeon spamming to lvl before the exp nerf.
I can understand the appeal to a degree and have enjoyed it myself very occasionally but I cant do it over and over across all my toons as a gearing path and it has a very esports vibe to it in terms of pacing for one.
Totally right about it trickling down to the normal and heroic stuff etc. I went straight from the entrance as a tank in a normal I think it was for a quest during Threads of Fate.
Everyone just stood there lol…because I didnt go right and hug the wall. One person left and the others reluctantly took the unfavorable path. What happens in M+ certainly doesnt stay there and it really doesnt matter what direction you go in as long as you get it done.
Except of course for the one thing M+ emphasizes more than anything…time. So whats fastest is all that matters. How it is with a lot of things but I think that metric is the most detrimental long term.
I think M+ popularity is more a reflection of how poorly updated PvP is lately as well as raiding and the expansion overall. M+ is the best of the end game options not because its all so exciting to play but because the rest is behind. That and only needing 5 ppl to do it vs raiding. A guild I was in wanted you to gear through M+ and/or pvp between raids which made sense.
Something about the M+ process needs work. It just doesnt feel good for me personally as it is now. Like its missing something that would make it an experience that I could enjoy long term.
I couldnt justify removing it myself I just think it needs tweaking or Blizzard needs to make a serious commitment to more than the dungeons we get at launch. Like plenty of other systems mostly now gone, it has great potential to evolve more.
2 new dungeons a patch or something to mix it up at least would be a nice addition.
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Dragonflight will be rotating dungeons, so that should help.
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You arent completely wrong but I feel not entirely accurate.
Prior to M+ you could spam dungeons to level. You could go back and would find the same experience doing that as you would M+.
I think now theres just a game mode to encourage it.
That sounds great. I MIGHT do it again when that comes out we will see.
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