It’s bs in PvP (especially when combined with necro procs), and it’s dumb to have our AoE be determined by RNG. We can and have done so much better.
Replace it with Fury of Xuen because:
A) It’s far more engaging than RNG.
B) RNG has no place in our spec in the first place. Much less so in the area of the game where we’re supposed to shine.
C) FoX has potential to synergize with ID
D) Personally, this is how I feel Xuen should be in our spec. Not a major CD, but still relevant.
To fix our AoE. Just buff MotC back to Legion strength (and maybe give FoF like a 10% damage buff because it genuinely needs a buff). Keep the stack cap (for the time being). This does several things.
- No more RNG in our AoE. It’s flat strong and does its job.
1b) No more people getting randomly murked by procs in PvP and therefore less complaining about WW.
- Now we’re a natural deterrent to any pet class in PvP. If we tag a BM hunter (because they’re all over the place now) and their two pets, all we need is an extra tag and we do DoCJ damage on SCK basically all the time. Don’t even get me started on if Demo locks become a major force.
Just like that. Our strength is bolstered and RNG removed while there’s less noise from the PvP community about us. Though, there will always be a lot of the latter. Our AoE goes from good if procs to “you ain’t beating it unless we let you.”
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no way i just started gearing my WW alt and SCK goes BRRRRRR, really fun melting someone in a sweep. don’t ruin this for me. i had to deal with it on my main, now it’s my turn
You know that’s the sad part. Players just getting into WW thinking DoCJ is all that when we could do better with no RNG before.
The rest of the playerbase has never really had to deal with WW at full power before because we’ve always been limited in some shape or form. MoP was fun, but WW went through major changes basically every patch. WoD WW, unfortunately, existed. Legion had templates. BfA took away our very big guns. SL is RNG and gimmicks. Had Blizz just kept their hands off WW (like they do with mage, rogue, etc.) there’s a good chance we’d have rendered a fair number of specs and even whole classes irrelevant/redundant.
You wanna clap people? Tell Blizz to give us original Strike of the Windlord back. I can guarantee that it kills wider and faster than DoCJ procs. I still remember one of my highest hits from SotWL doing enough damage to one shot a geared bear, and it used to have unlimited cleave when it was first put in.
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This just isn’t true lol.
Original SotWL? The spell that had no target cap or reduction against many targets, and hit with the power of 2+ RSKs in a global w/o amps?
Need I reiterate that it was basically a bear druid oneshotting RSK that had unlimited cleave and was in a global?
The only reason people weren’t getting ripped to pieces by it in Legion (at least after month 1) was because it was nerfed in PvP by 40% then 30% on ability templates, our amps were also nerfed in PvP by ability templates, and our PvP template took several agi nerfs while our templated secondary stats were terrible.
I played legion ww since alpha and it literally never did even near the amount of damage you’re taking about.
SotWL clapped man. It got nerfed several times, but the 10M damage SotWL I remember was well into Antorus.
Also are we talking PvE or PvP damage? Because if you’re coming from the PvP standpoint, I can understand it, but it was a monster in PvE even post nerf. Blizz just made it not an AoE monster.
Then the highest I’ve ever seen on my SotWL was 10M. That is from both hits combined. No cleave included.
I did have the odd RSK crit for 10M too, but there was a good chance it had other buffs juicing it. Man I miss Memento of Angerboda. It’s utter bs that Blizz isn’t bringing back MoS from M+ TW.
I do feel we are getting a bit sidetracked though. Not that I wouldn’t want to see SotWL’s glorious return in its original uncapped AoE glory along with some modern WW improvements like BoK giving it CDR.
The level 45 talents should all be geared toward aoe as well or not at all.
I’d rather remove MotC.
I like MotC, but not as it is now. It feels too unimpactful as it is. It mattered in Legion and it showed. If you spread MotC like the plague, everything died in seconds. If you didn’t, they didn’t.
Level 45 talent row doesn’t need much work to fix. All they need to do is replace DoCJ with Fury of Xuen. And maybe replace Hit Combo with like double RSK from Legion. And that’s a BIG maybe. I don’t mind Hit Combo as it is now because I agree that old Hit Combo could be too jarring a drop if you botched mastery. Hell, I botch mastery a fair amount of time just because GCD is slow. Most of the time I catch when mastery is broken, I usually hit a sequence like BoK TP BoK, or TP BoK TP too fast and the game only registers double BoK or TP.
Umm, you do realize you’re a BM right? You are 10x worse than a monk…
Agreed, i have been running serenity/hitcombo whole season just refused to play the try get 6 stacks and rng proc spinny gameplay. Still playing at decent rating/top 100 so it can be done.
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Serenity is not bad at all, very scary cooldown, so it’s not like you’re playing the game on hard mode by making that choice.
It needs to have 2 charges before better than wdp.
However to the post
Dance itself isn’t the problem.
The problem is all those modifiers that go into dance like the conduit.
We shouldn’t be touching class design because of borrowed power.
I personally like having something that procs for free like that, some rng is ok.
In bfa I had triple dance, because of being able to rsk in it, because the proc would make that hit pretty large.
Dance proc thematically was like the winds was blowing our way use it now.
Would be better if we could trigger it some how ourselves, but that might be too much thinking for them.
I wouldn’t mind strike of the windlord coming back baseline myself, that was the one thing I liked about legion monk.
The free proc is nice. However, I don’t like damage being tied to RNG. So this gives us the unique opportunity to correct two mistakes.
If we delete DoCJ and buff MotC back to Legion strength, our AoE is objectively stronger and people don’t complain about getting gibbed by DoCJ/RNG.
Currently DoCJ with 6 MotC stacks with maxed conduit is 405% damage increase to SCK with RNG.
If DoCJ got axed (and replaced with Fury of Xuen) and MotC is buffed back to Legion strength, our MotC with 6 targets is a 420% damage increase to SCK with NO RNG. And with the addition of Fury of Xuen we get some extra love in the ST department along with decent spec flavor.
I get that you’re worried about nerfs, but whether we get development/buffs or not, WW basically always gets nerfs or dumb changes. Remember the travel time nerf to FSK? Remember RH is a PvP talent even though it should very much be baseline? Remember Pressure Points or Zen Med getting limited to BrM? We chin an unreasonable amount of stupid crap, and I get the feeling that we will keep doing so, which is why I feel it pertinent that we get solid improvements and performance.
Which won’t happen, or at least we won’t ever get the 20 stack mark of the crane thing going on in Legion that we had so we will always be under the strength MotC gave to SCK in Legion. At most they would likely buff the damage a little but I don’t see them actually buffing up the damage up that high at all (more likely just a smidgen of a buff and they would call it a day).
I do miss the 20 stacks though, nothing better than doing runs through Return of Karazhan and pulling everything up to the first boss and nuking it all with aoe and doing 50% or more of the damage in that pull.
We don’t need unlimited MotC stacks. We’re good with six. Six already outperforms what we currently have if it’s returned at 50% more SCK damage a stack.
It’s honestly stupid that it was changed in the first place, and never reverted. Instead we get some RNG crap that’s more trouble than it’s worth and FoF tickles.
Eh DH infinite laser was pretty fun too.