Just a reminder that not everyone has hours each day to play, and there is no detriment to the game by adding LFR for these people. If you disagree that casuals should be allowed to play the game and experience it, you’re just a gate-keeping sweat.
9 Likes
Solo players that would want LFR are not the only ones that can claim to be casual as I keep seeing this argument brought up. Being able to raid once or twice a week isn’t hardcore if that’s all you do in the game and that’s very easily possible in classic. With the changes they’ve made you will be able to step in way more easily normal raiding with full tier sets and some of the better raid trinkets and this will also make it much easier to clear normal.
Do I think they should have kept LFR? Yes because I know solo players were looking forward to it but I don’t disagree with the logic they brought up I would simply like for them to make it more consistent. If they only do this change toward their vision it feels a bit arbitrary and empty of meaning.
If we want players to build a strong community then maybe guild perks and levels should have stayed like back then as it makes players more prone to join a guild. Maybe GDKPs shouldn’t be allowed as they aren’t allowed on SoD and anniversary. etc.
2 Likes
People keep thinking that the only players using lfr are solo guildless players. I’ve always thought that lfr was mostly for the alts of players who were raiding with their guild on their main.
2 Likes
Casuals can play and have been playing the game just fine. You really didn’t need to make another spam thread to tell us all how you’re incapable of budgeting a couple hours to play the video game for the rewards you want.
2 Likes
The target demographic for me was always players that wouldn’t want to do normal. We’ve seen them as soon as wod trying to make LFR less of an attraction for people that didn’t want to do it as it’s not content many people liked and felt that they had to do to keep up. So I call this more an accident with mop LFR that was rectified later on.
LFR as an option is fine which is why in a world with H+ giving the same reward I would be okay with it but I still wouldn’t consider it content for everyone and I wouldn’t want everyone to feel like they have to do it as I don’t see it as a good way to experience content for most people.
1 Like
Hmmm, I guess since I was in a guild doing guild runs with my main all I saw was players in guilds doing lfr with their alts. So you were in a guild and you didn’t know any players in guilds doing lfr on their alts? One expansion I tried to schedule guild runs with one of my alts. I quickly decided that I didn’t want to schedule so many days to wow. I had other things I wanted to do with my life. So I raided with the guild on my main and just did lfr on my alts when I had the time. Did you have any alts? Did you schedule guild raids with those alts? Or did you just never raid on your alts?
Plenty of normal mode runs that you can join.
Sorry but no LFR for you my man.
1 Like
Next you’re gonna tell me people enjoyed farming 300+ maw of souls for artifact power in Legion because many did it. I guess warfronts and Thorgast were an huge success.
Or people simply did that for the rewards as they are so easy to get even if the content was mindlessly boring to them.
I know many people that did LFR and resented every moment of it.
On the contrary, people have goals and will do what is needed to get there. If you design a game you need to to account for people that will min/max in it and make it enjoyable. If the best way to play your game is terrible maybe you should fix it and I’m happy that H+ as fixed that part of mop.
1 Like
You know people say that all the time about so many things in this game. I find it hard to believe that so many people are so weak willed that they let them self be forced to do things they don’t want to do. But you’re telling me that many if not most of the players are so cowed and afraid of their guild leaders that they’re unable to exercise their free will and get forced to do lfr. Is that how you were or was it just most of the people you knew at the time?
So you’re saying that the game should be designed for the small number of players who min/max and not for the vast majority of casual players. Since you can’t please everyone I’ve always felt the game should be designed for the majority of the players.
6 Likes
If you want to please the vast majority of solo players then you don’t want an mmorpg that focus on the social aspect. You want a mobile phone game.
Min/maxing is something most players do in some way, if you have equipped better gear, enchanted it or gemmed it then you have done some level of min/maxing. And all of those should be fun the same way that if you want to play the best way that best way should be fun.
It’s not about not designing the game for casual but making the game fun for everyone. The problem here is that this isn’t about casual players but solo players. Is it normal that solo players feel like that a mmorpg game which emphase the social aspect is not designed for them? Yes I think that’s fair. You can’t please everyone and if people don’t want to play with a community or a guild then they’re the one choosing to not participate in the game. Do I think some stuff can be done toward this kind of player? Yes if it means that the goal is to make them eventually join communities or guilds but it shouldn’t come at the cost of the main group of players you’re trying to please and focus the experience on.
2 Likes
There you go again with the solo players line. When I go to a city almost every player I see is in a guild. And almost all of them are not in full raid bis. So where are you seeing all these solo players?
Sure people use the best gear that dropped for them and enchant some of it and use gems. But have you actually looked at their gear? What I see is gear that is less than bis with cheaper enchants and cheaper gems. That’s not min/maxing. Most people don’t min/max the way the hard core guilds do. And players in casual guilds don’t get “forced” to do lfr.
Yes it is certainly fair. The game should not be designed for solo players. But again, where are you seeing all these solo players? Even in lfr back in the day most of the players were in a guild. I just assumed they were alts since I was an alt too. Have you ever bothered to look around you at the other players to see if they were in a guild?
1 Like
I would argue that if you really are a militant solo only player who objects to the idea that you might have to communicate or interact with other players in order to get what yo want out of the game, then maybe you shouldn’t be playing an MMO to begin with.
There are plenty of single player RPGs that would probably be better suited to someone who fits that description.
1 Like
It’s been proven time and time again on retail, people might absolutely hate certain content, but at the end of the day… The path of least resistance will always prevail.
1 Like
You’ll notice the exponential decay that happens to M+ participation in retail, both as the season goes on, and as the key level goes up.
Early season M+ participation is hard carried by raiders who are farming gear to be useful in raid, and once they start not having to care about crests and vault, they get out as early as possible.
1 Like
Certain players assume it’s true without any proof. And it’s usually players in hard core guilds that assume every body is trying to do what they do and failing at it and that we respect them for their accomplishments. But the reality is most of the casuals don’t care about the hard core accomplishments, aren’t trying to emulate them, and don’t even notice them as they run past them in the major cities. We think you hard core players are no life losers. We don’t respect you, we pity you.
Come on now, you can check my achievements to see that I’m not a hardcore player, at most I have a handful of AotC achievements from SoO to Nyalotha. No CE’s, no high end M+ achievements, no arena rating higher than 1550 in 2’s. There is a chance I am actually more casual than you are.
I also only have 148 mounts and 159 pets.
1 Like
Yeah, but per GD logic, any AOTCs at all means you’re not a casual.
Because GD often uses ‘casual’ when they mean the unrelated term ‘bad at the game’.
2 Likes
Even if the dates were way after the raids opened? I was always in guilds that progressed through normal(heroic after WoD launch) extremely slowly. Only raiding 3 hours a week probably didn’t help
Ok, but I don’t know how to check your achievements. I could figure out how to do it but I just don’t care. I’m not in competition with anyone.
Perhaps, this is the first time in wow that I’m not in a guild and I’ve been playing from release date of vanilla. But if so why do you care if lfr is added? I was in a casual guild in cata, Mop, and WoD and never was forced to do lfr on my main. I guild raided with my main and did an occasional lfr with my alts.
Plenty on retail and since Classic hasn’t had LFR you could argue also that it did help to reduce the amount of solo players and make people play with guilds.
That’s not relevant to the min/maxing talk, not everyone does it in the same amount and that was the goal of my example. You might not have the best gear but most people are trying their best at least up to what is fun is for them.
For me that’s a very weird mindset in a game based on progression. How dare people do more than me and play the game more that they enjoy when it’s designed to be played that way? Weird. I get it there are priorities which I think designing the game to be social is one but it’s not like it’s wrong for people to also want to play the game more.