Daily reminder that unranked pvp gear ilvl is pathetically low and needs to be on par with at LEAST heroic raid gear

Like my wintergrasp, and ret paladin posts before this one, I will be bumping this thread every day until unrated pvp gear is buffed to be on par with at least heroic raid gear in terms of item level.

Some context: I’ve made two posts based on ret paladins being broken overpowered and shortly after that, ret paladin self healing was nerfed. I made a post about wintergrasp defending being far too overpowered, and in the next patch wintergrasp defending is getting nerfed.

Well, I am now making a post about unrated pvp gear being pathetic in terms of item level and stats. And as per my past posts, i will be bumping this thread every day until unrated gear item level is buffed.

The reason it needs to be buffed is because gladiator pvp players are absolutely destroying unranked players in battlegrounds. 226 item level players just deleting your entire team because they play ranked content. And because I don’t play ranked content, blizzard punishes me by making my item level low. My item level being low means lesser primary and secondary stats. My item level being low means i die to gladiators. It should NOT be this way and i refuse to accept this.

Remember in wod when honor gear and conquest gear was the same item level even against gladiator players? Remember if you got a high rating the only thing you got was a transmog set, weapon illusions, and a much larger conquest cap?

Why does blizzard think this is a bad system? Why do they instead think that making high ranked arena players absolutely dominate unranked casual players in battlegrounds equates to a good gameplay feature?

I did the math a few weeks ago and to upgrade an entire set of honor gear it costs 68,400 honor. Weeks of grinding BG’s to only have 197 item level. We arguably grinded more than rank 1 players for our honor and are rewarded with being completely inferior and being dominated by gladiator players. There is almost no point even upgrading gear anymore. It’s more worth it to pay a rank 1 player to carry you with gold in arenas in order to get good pvp gear.

The game should not be this way. I shouldn’t have to be constantly stressing about how low my item level is as a casual pvp player because im constantly facing rivals, duelists, gladiators, rank 1 players, grand marshals, etc. I shouldn’t be PUNISHED for being a casual pvp player who wants to play alts.

Unranked pvp gear, as well as honor gear, needs to be buffed in item level by a significant amount. At a MINIMUM it should be equal to heroic raid gear. Heroic raids are easy. But heroic raid gear doesnt have pvp stats. The ideal pvp stats come from pvp. But you can ONLY have success in pvp if you are high rating. And to get high rating you need to have high versatility, which can only come from being high rated. It’s a vicious cycle.

This NEEDS to change. It’s demoralizing to be destroyed by players with 40k or more health every bg. It’s demoralizaing to realize ill never have that item level on my alts because I cannot physically rank up and gain rating on so many alts. It’s demoralizing that all of my efforts to gear my character with honor are wasted because of how pathetic the item level is. This HAS To change. It H A S to change. It has to change.

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I’m somebody that wants the WoD gearing system back, but it’s getting exhausting hearing that people need to have bis gear on their alts because they cannot compete in unranked without it.

Like,
I have 3 alts right now. I got the s-priest 1800 pugging with a friend, and the DK and Hunter are doing absolutely fine in randoms and haven’t really stepped into rated yet. (Was supposed to be doing RBGs on the Hunter, but I joined a team on my main and haven’t had time since.)
Heck, I’m not even seeing this issue in the level people are talking about and I queue 51-59 BGs on my alts to level in the evenings solo.

Does it suck if I run into a premade? Yes. It’s called I either grab some friends myself, or just go queue another character. Casuals can group. Solo play does not mean casual.

I live in unrated PvP, and I’ve been playing my alts more than my main.
I honest to god don’t see these non-stop 5 man geared duelist/gladiator premades that people complain about. Hell, when I run my own on Alliance, it’s maybe 1-2 geared people and then crappy alts, or people who are flat out brand new to PvP.

I seriously also don’t understand how Horde players can complain non-stop about this, when you guys have the majority of the competitive playerbase - and thus more geared players.

ps; you are not the reason for the epic BG nerds and ret paladins.
That’s something the community rallied together about, and you were far from close to the only person talking about it. Holy heck.

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Are my posts the reason blizzard decides to address issues? No. I’m not that arrogant.

My posts get a lot of interaction and support because they are accurate in their criticisms of the systems and classes in this game.

It’s a legitimate complaint. Only recently has blizzard favored rated players and made them completely dominate casuals. This is a RECENT development that needs to be changed.

I’m glad you got 1800 pugging with a friend and you again seem to miss the point. This is for unranked people. Honor gear should be 2nd bis to conquest gear. And conquest gear should be a static item level in pvp regardless of rating.

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Just to give some context to this, in Cata it cost 26k honor for an honor set that was only 13 ilvl lower than the conquest set (390 vs 403). In Wrath, the gap between s7 and s8 gear was 19 (251 vs 270).

These sets also had a pvp stat that reduced damage, not boost it.

Current pvp gearing is filled with oversights due to understandable delays and rushed development. Threads like this are necessary as part of building awareness so we can lobby blizz as it juggles fixing things after a rough previous year for development. Ion mentioning WoD gearing shows he’s paying attention.

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There is only a few (3 or 6?) levels difference between unranked conquest gear and the gear we can get from world quests and follower missions.
Not to mention the 3 level difference between conquest and capped honor gear.
I don’t recall when the conquest gear ilvl was as insignificant as it’s current iteration.

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You can’t.

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there shouldn’t be bis ilvl, only bis stat builds for your personal playstyle. thats the problem, you want to rank up but cant because you hit a ilvl/meta combo barrier that is difficult even for experienced pvpers.

i doubt your DK is doing fine.

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That’s only because it’s true. If randoms didn’t have premades of highly geared elites in them, it wouldn’t be such an issue. And also, wod conquest gear was bis for everybody, and everybody could work toward it.

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i agree with myself

daily reminder!

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Reporting in on another Zombie thread :yum:

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Like I said in systemlands beta.

Cut the honor costs for fully upgraded honor gear by half.

Then bump up the base conquest level to 207/210, or what ever ilevel BlizZard wanted.

But since Dear Leader said they are looking at the WoD system for PVP I guess that will work too!

:surfing_woman: :surfing_man:

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Are you out of your mind? Are you so ignorant to believe that anybody that has multiple pieces or a set of conquest gear obtained it casually? It’s physically not possible without grinding some sort of ranked content. And if you see where this is going that means that they are not just sitting on ilvl 200 conquest. The pieces are probably sitting a 226 or 220 at least. that’s a 23 ilvl difference to honor gear not 3. Ilvl is everything this expansion. The differance between 197 to 220 is around 10k hp/stats. It’s not uncomment to see players with 46k and up hp pools in random unranked content. Just stomping on everyone like goomba’s or being literal immortal bug zapper healers.

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Hey Shirt, I think you’re wrong on this because there’s an exponential disparity in how everything functions. Right now it’s hard to become competently geared with random bgs alone, the entirety it takes to get kitted out results in roughly 98,000 honour with 500-800 honour per win. That’s a lot.

The gear disparity has never been higher either. Going into bgs with roughly 20-28k versus someone who has 30-40k results in a heavy handicap for them. It’s almost next to impossible to damage them meanwhile they’re eating through you with a 10-20% versatility buff thanks to how versatility works.

With how casual bgs focus on you winning to actually achieve something much faster at minimum a 2x a rate in difference, it becomes next to impossible to gear when you’re Alliance and actively losing.

There needs to be a gap closer either coming at 9.0.5 or people are going to start disappearing from BGs. It certainly feels like a few have.

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lol @ dear leader

I do wish Ion was a more transparent personable guy

he seems to utterly lack the passion of the founders

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At this point it has been extremely easy to accrue multiple pieces of conquest gear without touching rated play.
That was not my point, however; I feel that it’s difficulty to acquire only accentuates my point.
Unranked conquest and honor should not be separated by 3 lousy levels

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The gear gap is out of control. As a 226 healer though I’d say I cannot carry a BG like a 226 geared DPS can for example. Played against a 226 geared Ret yesterday whose divine storm hit for 27k. Practically deleted half the team on an AB node.

Shadowlands pvp is an arcade game. Out of control Burst because of the 300 systems they had to balance and a massive gear gap issue. Its garbage.

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The reason unranked gear is so sub-par and the reason it’s such a slog to acquire is because if it were stronger and more easy to get, then PvE’ers would feel compelled to PvP.

Yeah, I know. PvP’ers have felt forced to PvE during several expansions, but we can’t expect Blizzard to just disregard them all to benefit us and their experiences should matter too.

Loathe as I am to advocate for a dedicated PvP stat like resilience, it’s needed if we want unranked gear to be better without forcing PvE’ers into environments they don’t want to be in.

Edit: WoD-style item level scaling works too. I don’t mean to insinuate that resilience is the only way, just that there needs to be a steeper division between PvE and PvP gear.

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So right now the conquest cap is so high you can easily grind out a full set of level 200 gear. Then you just need a measly 1600 rating and a bit of honor grind and full 213.

How much easier do people want it to be? Grinding a full set of 213 from heroic raiding could take months with how trash the drop rates are. Way way harder than grinding 60,000 honor. Also mix in some covenant 197 gear which is easy and any Cheap items from the AH you can build a set fast.

PvP gearing is easy as hell right now. PvE gearing is what needs fixing and thankfully they’re working on. Bringing back valor/justice etc is much needed.

People that have the gear already put in the work to get it. I fought my way through the 40k health players with junk gear on my main and now my gear is up there too.

1600 rating against people getting carried and facing gladiators with 220 item level is not easy.

You obviously just started the game. In wod for example, honor and conquest gear was a static item level. You bought the gear and were geared for pvp. The gear also had really good set bonuses.

Having to grind rating against people boosting just to not die in 2 globals is a terrible system.

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I don’t really see the harm in drip-feeding casuals some Heroic iLvL gear over the course of a season. Similar to how casual/unrated bgs in BFA rewarded a full Heroic iLvL set as long as you stayed current on capping conquest.

Makes the game more alt-friendly/alt-accessible too, which is always a plus. I would love nothing more than to just ignore all this grindy/boring Shadowlands content, and have a full roster of Heroic iLvL alts by just playing casual bgs :drooling_face:

I really enjoyed casual bgs in Season 4 BFA and I suspect the main reason is I could just log into a bunch of Heroic-tier alts and immediately hop into bgs with no grinding or other extra BS required. Log in, queue some bgs, log out, with 0 (or minimal) PvE, it was good times.

Fast forward to Shadowlands, and PvPing on alts is not a fun experience imo… a 185-195 character versus a 225+ character is just a slaughter :grimacing:

Yes, rated PvPers and Mythic raider types should always have an edge versus casuals (since they’ve earned it), but I don’t see the harm in bumping up the casual iLvL a little.

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