Crit vs Mastery instead of Crit + Mastery

What if (hear me out), early in the Havoc tree we get a choice node that lets you pick between Any Means Necessary and Know your Enemy? You pick either crit or mastery instead of basically both. Obviously numbers need to be tweaked, but it would let us get actual fun capstones instead. Never understood why Fel bombardment was taken out for example, that was the whole reason I was looking forward to a glaive build. Had a lot of fun in both PvP and PvE with that legendary during prepatch :frowning:

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I like them at the end of the trees instead of at the beginning. What did you like about choice nodes that made you want to force that as a choice?

Stat/passive damage increases as such is incredibly strong. Can you imagine a build without either? The only reason you’re not picking Any Means Necessary in raid is because the damage buff doesn’t weigh up against the “talents” for single target fights you have to pick to get there.

This heavily dictates which build you’re going to get. Know Your Enemy is pretty much mandatory because of how well it scales crit damage, and Any Means Necessary is another stat modifier making those crits stronger. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a build since DF that doesn’t pick this side of the tree, even if it’s without Initiative. The thing is that Initiative and other % based damage increases double (and sometimes triple) dip in those talents, meaning you can’t go without picking them. It creates a strong synergy that obsoletes most other options.

By making it a choice you limit multiplicative scaling while also being able to emphasize a crit or mastery build. I also don’t think Any Means Necessary should’ve been a capstone in the first place, the only logical choice there is Fel Bombardment.

dont forget that after i think 30% you get a tax, so even with the talents you are taxed,
after i get 35% in one stat i start increasing others.

The difference is minimum at the first 2 levels of diminishing returns. On top of that there are flat % increases that are not affected by those diminishing returns, Initiative crit being one of them.

In your second post, which side of the tree were you talking about? I can agree that when you go down the left side you will most likely choose Know Your Enemy and when you go down the right side you will most likely choose Any Means Necessary, but I wouldn’t go so far as to say that either is necessary in any one talent build, so I suppose I agree with you that way. What would you say about having both as earlier talent choices and not as a choice between the two?

Left side, mainly Initiative and Know Your Enemy stacking. With 10.1 it might be that Chaos Theory is fixed as well, which makes the Essence Break window even stronger with that stacked crit.

You can’t play the current state of Havoc without Essence Break, and not taking Initiative gives you a significant DPS loss. Any Means Necessary isn’t picked in ST builds due to the talents in front of it being pretty much dead, so you can’t even properly commit to a Mastery build as you’d need a second set with haste instead of mastery for ST.

Such a weird thought process when at the end of it all youre going to sim everything. Speccing into AMN doesnt mean youre just going to go full mastery and vice versa.

No, but it matters whether you go haste or mastery as secondary, it makes a decent difference.