Hey there, true believers. I wanted to build off a comment I made in this thread:
In short, in lieu of a High King, I posed the often discussed council of leaders for the Alliance. The model the Seven Kingdoms used in the days before the fall of Lordaeron, but with the diverse peoples that now make up the faction. These were my picks:
Anduin Wrynn - Stormwind
Tyrande Whisperwind - Kaldorei (Malfurion is not equipped for politics)
Genn Greymane - Gilneas
Velen - Exodar and the Army (I believe he represents both their interests closely)
Moira Thaurissan - Dwarf Clans (controversial choice, I was gonna put Dagran at first, but after orchestrating Ragnarosās defeat and everything that followed, Moira seems to have a solid care for the Clans as a whole)
Jaina Proudmoore - Kul Tiras
Gelbin Mekkatorque - Gnomeregan (heāll be fine)
Vereesa Windrunner - Silver Covenant and Renādorei (I was initially gonna put Alleria, but as sheās been away from Azeroth for 1000 years, I feel like her viewpoints might be a bit lacking - not to mention the controversy of putting a Void Elf in charge)
This is my ideal leader - an eight man council of leaders from diverse peoples, and not five humans meeting in a human city. While I know this topic has been often discussed, I thought itād be fun to pose this in light of recent events.
This isnāt just an Alliance thread, Iād like to see Horde posters pose their ideal councils as well (I didnāt want to make one as a blue poster). If your faction leader were replaced with representatives of the whole rather than a singularity, who would you want elected?
If we have to give up the Hordeās iconic Warchief position because writers donāt feel they can muster the energy to create a story where they donāt go berserk, then I say the only viable alternative is the other iconic Horde political entity.
Hey, without a Legion to try and gain āultimate powerā from maybe theyād actually be a capable group of leaders.
EDIT:
On topic, mostly if the Horde had to get a council, Iād say go with a council of military leaders.
Say Nathanos, Eitrigg, Liadrin (or Halduron, guy needs some spotlight), Rokhan, Patch, andā¦ umm pally tauren I canāt remember the name of I guess?
Velen knew he was being followed by the Legion and didnāt even think to warn the Orcs about his old pal KJ. Heās an incompetent pious fool whose mistakes led to massive loss of life. He was forgiven and now leads a player species.
NerāZhul made mistakes but as a character has always had a motivation that is rational, even if sometimes brutal.
From a species that names things after old war criminals and venerates bloodthirsty killers left and right, this is just another day in Orcish character development. Forgive and let unlive, I say.
Aim for a better story, not a worse one. Besides thisā¦ piece of festering fallacy, itās off topic. You wanna talk about Warchief Nerāzhul, make a thread about it.
Didnāt think I could hear a worse idea than Warchief Wrathion, but by god you did it. Also, you seem to have gotten confused and assumed Iām advocating for the removal of the Warchief position. Iām not.
Iām also uninterested in hearing about who you want for Warchief. Not the topic.
No itās not. If we have to have a council then I pick the Shadow Council, and at the head is NerāZhul as the Orc representative. There is nothing ridiculous about it that isnāt just as ridiculous as stuff that is already in the story and we have forgiven mass-murderers and cosmic monsters time and time again.
Remember when the game narratively forgave Algalon for his genocide of countless peoples because one of them resisted his murder hard enough for him to have the same revelation that twelve year olds have - āOther people are PEOPLE!?ā
Or when the game gave KilāJaeden symbolic forgiveness via dooking VELEN, because he changed his mind thanks to violence and only when it cost him absolutely nothing!?
NerāZhul was tricked into becoming the agent of the Legion and broke apart his dying world trying to save his people. Later, consumed by vengeance and twisted he enacted a brutal plan to get revenge on the genocide army that despoiled him, his people and his world.
There is nothing wrong with a story where he is returned to unlife and works to help his people as he once did, bringing with him regrets, remorse and new perspectives.
I genuinely pick the shadow council and itās a damned good idea.
That is some very cherrypicked and incomplete lore youāve got there.
Incorrect. I donāt say this lightly, but you have somehow managed to prove yourself worse than the current writing team. I award you no points and may god have mercy on your soul.
Genn, Malfurion, Muradin, Tandred, and Velen come together every Friday night to play poker. They discuss what the Alliance should do next and report back to their handlers (Anduin, Tyrande, Moira, Jaina, and Anduin again) after the game. The Alliance will then be run like that for the remainder of the game. Insider info says Genn has the best poker face but Tandred slipped in a deck of novelty āNaked Princesses of the Eastern Kingdomsā cards for one game, and when he got three Tessās he flipped out into Worgen form and almost bit off his face. Muradin also lost his shoulderpads to Velen for a week, who was seen wearing them around the Exodar like trophies.
Do you have anything to say about it other than that you donāt like it? Such as how it is incompatible with themes or narrative principles that you think are inviolable or that shouldnāt be compromised? I have pointed out that the gameās story has done similarly baffling absolutions before and that there is a potential for this story to bring back an old Horde entity, preserving a sense of tradition, and develop the story in an interesting new direction with a character who has a unique perspective. My opinion is that this is desirable, but I am hardly stating just that opinion, thereās more to it than that.
So do you have an actual objection, or are you just going to insult me and assert your supremacy as a judge of story?
Just because the game has committed baffling rug sweeps in the past does not make another baffling rug sweep - especially one in which you make a man who once plotted to eradicate all life on the planet, including he supposedly wanted to save - acceptable.
Utter crap. Probably the worst Iāve seen on the forums. Worse than Warchief Wrathion. Worse than Aspect of Death Alexstrasza. Worse than kraken rescuing Garrosh.
Iām sweeping away nothing. The Orc did some messed up crap, but he was also a vengeful spirit at the time and had been created to serve the legion as a weapon. He was dancing to their tune, which was to wipe out all life, but secretly planned to turn the Legionās weapon against them. Moreover, he was eradicated as a presence by Arthas so he isnāt even culpable for the events of Wrath of the Lich King.
A story where he is revived and declares that now he is free he wants to help the Horde he did so much (so much wrong, admittedly, but the guy tried and Warcraft morality scores on intentions) to try and help is not even a rug sweep. Itās just further development, and given that the Orcs have learned to live with what they did under Demon 'Roids, them extending a wary but principled second chance to the guy who was turned into a weapon by that same corrupting entity isnāt outside the bounds of reason. You could have the Horde be initially distrustful but extend that chance based on the fact that in his new incarnation the guy has achieved a harmony with the elements again. He was a Shaman, once.
I mean, the Death Knight PC walks past characters who spit at and threaten them when they walk into Org and they let them walk right up to the Warchief. Iām not saying that NerāZhul is on the same scale, but the same principle applies.
You say āAim for a better story, not a worse one.ā - but this is neither. This is just the same kind of event Warcraft has been full of since day one. And, given it involves themes of shamanism, forgiveness and moving past the legacies of cruelty in oneās past, itās even got some Horde themes that arenāt based in killing the Alliance!
Again, your blunt refusals arenāt even hot takes, theyāre just lukewarm opinions. Why is it worse? Work with me here.
Talanji - I like her more after she became Queen. She is loyal to the Horde but kept a modicum of independence. She also picked a non-troll for her council. She seems forward thinking and like she learns from the past. Very important traits.
Rommath - heās usually right about the outcomes even if his logic and reasons are selfish. What ever his reasons, he calls events well.
Lasan - he seems gung ho as well as prudent. He would be my Tauren liaison.
Geyarah - I like the cut of her jib.
Gallywix - he is also another guy I would want around my council. He would be like the devil over our shoulders. He would have insight on profit and power.
I would want Garona but I couldnāt trust her. She gets honorable mention.
I pretty much agree with your list. But Iād give Umbric and Vareesa separate positions, and more in an advisory role, than full membership, since they both have like 10 followers a piece, instead of running whole nations (subject to change, of course, if they ever re-take Quelāthalas).
Also, something with Aysa. We know there are Tushui who believe in the Alliance cause enough to die for it, and that deserves a voice. Just not sure if itād be like a full membership, or more of an Umbric-tier seat.
![:panda_face:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/panda_face.png?v=6" ":panda_face:")
![:woman_cook:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/woman_cook.png?v=6" ":woman_cook:")