and having superior modifiers
shattering blade should just automatically grant RI or be changed to consume a specific resource outside RI
8 Likes
Lets be real here. You and I both know the devs simply donāt know how to make frost decent in pvpā¦ They have tried multiple times now with pvp specific tuning and its still bad. At this point it makes them look incompetent.
4 Likes
FS sucks with 2h. Way better with DW. Was hitting 100k plus FS with that setup, in season one. I think the biggest I got was 160k. Sooooo no coil doesnāt hit harder on a per global basis. You can use more of them but FS should be at the near 200k mark if you set up your build and gear right.
No idea why they nerfed shatterting when it was a good way to promote sustained damage.
yeah it actually does stop being a clown, coil has higher base damage than FS
And the modifiers required to make it hit well over 100k are far less obnoxius than whats required for FDK to do the same, its literally just a proc compared to prebuilding razorice, then popping all your cds, then pressing froststrike, and critting
Coil does it so casually frost has to work very hard to see similar results, additionally unholy coils can build their mortalstrike effect adding even more pressure to a single GCD press, and their mortalstrike steals healing adding survivability to the same global press, Oh did i mention its a ranged ability too?
Oh lets not forget about when after this coil proc happens now your clawing shadows hits 50% harder
3 Likes
No it doesnāt, no need for insults. Itās Raz btw, canāt swap posting toons for some reason.
79%/105% (2h/DW) vs 56%. Baseline. So in every possible way you were wrong. Itās Raziael btw.
No they arenāt firstly, itās a whole build change. Same as running a DW spec vs 2h for Frost.
No it isnāt. Death rot stacks are a hell of a lot slower to work up than razor ice when running DW. RW full stack takes 2 globals.
??? Frost strike adds 6% strength, on critical reduces the cd of pillar, and in pvp extends the duration of chains while lowering haste by 8%.
Not sure what youāre on about other than you donāt like what blizzard did which is what you suggested. You and the posting members of the frost community and devs silly enough to listen to you were/are the main problem with the spec. Not Unholy not other classes. You got what you wanted only to find out you really didnāt.
2 Likes
my coils donāt have a 100k+ hit in pvpā¦ unless you guys are talking about spending all the runic power, so in a continuous cannon of shots reaching 150k+, in about 6 coils or more with a chance of single procs.
1 Like
I find frost strike itself a stupid spell.
I mean, if you put a knife on a freezer for a whole day and then stab someoneā¦ does it make a difference?
At least in legion this had a range, so it was like the sword cut flying into your oponent.
2 Likes
Iāve suggested a ton of fixes for it; the major issue atm is that shattering blade is nerfed. All FS needed really was to be added to MOTFW for 2h along with howling blast and shattering strikes not to consume RI stacks. Envenom for rogues used to work the exact same and they changed it because it wasnāt a good mechanic.
1 Like
Thats a quick way to absolutely kill DW. What would it be getting in response to adding everything to MotFW?
not factoring in their PvP specific modifier,
You wernt specific, and youre still wrong playing all the best possible froststrike talents for a build and landing the highest possible froststrike will still be inferior to playing all the deathcoil talents and landing the highest deathcoil why? Because Deathcoil pops 2 wounds as well, from range adds a 90% slow and builds a 8% healing reduction on the target, while also building up the damage from consecutive coils, while also being free of cost conserving extra runic power for using deathstrike
Froststrike in comparison is highly inefficient and just straight up bad theres no possibility you could give me an entire list like that of the benefits froststrike has over deathcoil, Its just a bad button and no matter what build you use it will still be the worse runic spender
deathrot is not needed to hit very hard hitting coils, its the combination of doomburst sudden doom with the new pvp modifier buffs they got. It simply applies far more pressure than noodlestrike in every capacity and from range
Weak and irrelevant in pvp, PvE min max talent that has no value in pvp
Overnerfed before s1 started, Crit also being dks weakest stat and the one you have the least of
Dead talent that you thought would help your argument
but actually just went to show that you dont pvp at all
They did what i wanted in principle, but what they didnt do was get the numbers right froststrike wasnt buffed enough, our entire talent trees and honor talents didnt get the rework like we were promised last patch, Deathstrike is still overnerfed for talent interactions that dont exist anymore, Icecap the funnest and most promising talent fdk had for pvp is still overnerfed considering its the only possible way to salvage the idea of staying in to do sustain dps to farm pillar back
2 Likes
Your entire premise and now you need several entire paragraphs to dodge and shift goal posts. Lets see if you edit the thread title to try and doge what your argument was.
Coil hitting harder than FS baseline
in case you do lol.
Bad.
LOL maybe you all thinking youāve got the frost meta solved while being objectively the worst spec in pvp need to go back to the theory craft drawing board.
2200 as Unholy running no voice, done in 6 hrs right before the end of that season.
Maybe the devs will be charitable enough to take the spec out of the basement despite the frost community being a dumpster fire but I doubt it.
You seem bitter. Maybe you should chill. (Like the dead pvp talent)
1 Like
Well done lmao!
Still does, 1 coil press =more damage than 1 froststrike press
or did you forget it cleaves too?
2 Likes
One of 7-12 talents we take to make coil not suck, coil cleave isnāt baseline. When I get home Iāll post some pics that are not on my laptop. Even with that cleave coil just pulls even with DW frost strike, and getting those bigger FS requires way less investment than a Coil build.
Edit have the pics. If the pvp dummy does not take into account Shattering being nerfed then we re calculate to see what the actual value would be. Otherwise the clear winner is DW frost strike.
bro im sorry to break it to you but opening those screenshots just made me laugh
nice gear, Clearly someone doesnt actually play the game
You seem to have missed every single other point i made in my posts also
Damage doesnt have to just mean the raw number, damage can also be interpreted as the setback suffered when a button is pushed
Ill make this really simple for you since you dont understand yet
Deathcoil is a better button press in every capacity than froststrike is
Deathcoil is Ranged
Deathcoil Cleaves
Deathcoil Builds a healing reduction effect, and simultaneously pops wounds for more damage which can be accounted as part of deathcoil (50k-60k noncrit deathcoil +30k +30k non crits from wound pops or 80k-100k Deathcoil crit +58k +58k festering wound crits from doombringer +90% slow + -8% healing reduction 1 gcd
Deathcoil builds a stacking debuff
Deathcoil applies a disease that deals 30% additional damage as the coil hit for
Deathcoil applies a 90% slow
Deathcoil has a high chance to be free of cost
so what does froststrike do?
hits for average 30k, crits for average 70-80k, Fully bursting and talented can crit for 130k-150k
melee range
builds 2% strength
Lol stop bro they arent even remotely close to being equal
Deathcoil is more of everything
Theyre not even comparable
3 Likes
A little bird told me that dev/frost/disc is still good.
Also that aug/frost/disc is excellent.
1 Like
Isnāt this the whole point of your thread?
Coil only pops wounds if talented into doomburst which you usually donāt do in 3s when your partner is a spellcaster. In that case you run necro aura.
1 Like
No I addressed those points and you were wrong on every one of them. BTW those pics show FS from DW doing something like 20k avg more than Coil. Your new list of āpointsā is goal post shift number 4 or 5 in this thread and itās quite funny at this point. FS does a lot more than your suggesting as well, intellectual honesty is really not your thing. No wonder the spec is a dumpster fire.
Lets finish the list using the same criteria that you used for coil.
20% chance on crit to proc KM (better than 2h b/c both main and off hand strikes can proc this)
100% KM proc when in Piller talented obliterate (obv no one using breath b/c nerf)
Refreshes chains of Ice/Haste debuff or causes movement cds to have a longer refresh (pvp talents)
Hits far harder in equal level gear as shown.
Lets also not forget that Frost has way better mastery scaling baseline.
So last thing Iām going to say here is this: youāre wrong in every way and if you want to know why the spec is trash itās because of the changes you suggested. Well deserved too from what I can see in this exchange.