I would love to play classic. I'm willing to pay a sub to do that but at the same time I don't want any of that money going toward retail wow. I don't even want to have access to it... but mostly I don't want to support retail wow development in any way. I definitely won't be paying the same sub price for a game I played over a decade ago. 15 is a no-go.
The company is one entity so it would go towards retail even if it gave you that choice.
You don't get to decide what Blizzard does with your money.
If you can't afford the sub, then either farm tokens on retail or move on. You're not in a position to haggle.
If you can't afford the sub, then either farm tokens on retail or move on. You're not in a position to haggle.
11/03/2018 10:28 PMPosted by GlavedThe company is one entity so it would go towards retail even if it gave you that choice.
I do not think this train of thought is perfectly appropriate, as companies can and will analyze where the money is coming from. While I am fine with a fused sub, I can understand that some people think this could be used to demonstrate how World of Warcraft as a whole, and not just Classic, is performing through misrepresentations during analysis.
I don't think Blizzard would hurt themselves analyzing in that way, but that's just my opinion.
11/03/2018 10:32 PMPosted by ThathotgirlYou don't get to decide what Blizzard does with your money.
If you can't afford the sub, then either farm tokens on retail or move on. You're not in a position to haggle.
You don't get to decide if the player spends their money on blizz product in the first place. Blizzard has to "earn" it. If they don't have what's right for that particular person, then they dont get it. If blizzard wants to leave thousands/hundreds of thousands of separate subs on the table then that's within their rights too. Although their shareholders may have a brain aneurysm for ignoring untapped market and lowering their stocks.
People who vote with their wallets are in every position to haggle. Take a good look at the current sub numbers. Less than two million aka bfa doa. they are scrambling to maintain sub numbers by offering it as a freebie to current users.
11/03/2018 11:15 PMPosted by Gattz11/03/2018 10:32 PMPosted by ThathotgirlYou don't get to decide what Blizzard does with your money.
If you can't afford the sub, then either farm tokens on retail or move on. You're not in a position to haggle.
You don't get to decide if the player spends their money on blizz product in the first place. Blizzard has to "earn" it. If they don't have what's right for that particular person, then they dont get it. If blizzard wants to leave thousands/hundreds of thousands of separate subs on the table then that's within their rights too. Although their shareholders may have a brain aneurysm for ignoring untapped market and lowering their stocks.
People who vote with their wallets are in every position to haggle. Take a good look at the current sub numbers. Less than two million aka bfa doa. they are scrambling to maintain sub numbers by offering it as a freebie to current users.
You don't know the current sub numbers though, so there is that.
No one is trying to control how you spend your money, not sure why you even say that, now would you pay 15$ if it was classic only?
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You don't get to decide if the player spends their money on blizz product in the first place. Blizzard has to "earn" it. If they don't have what's right for that particular person, then they dont get it. If blizzard wants to leave thousands/hundreds of thousands of separate subs on the table then that's within their rights too. Although their shareholders may have a brain aneurysm for ignoring untapped market and lowering their stocks.
People who vote with their wallets are in every position to haggle. Take a good look at the current sub numbers. Less than two million aka bfa doa. they are scrambling to maintain sub numbers by offering it as a freebie to current users.
You don't know the current sub numbers though, so there is that.
No one is trying to control how you spend your money, not sure why you even say that, now would you pay 15$ if it was classic only?
they haven't posted sub numbers to refute the fake posted sub numbers recently. Why is that? Hmmmmmm. Stubs you have read my other posts and you keep asking the same questions for some odd reason. No I wouldn't pay 15 for a separate sub. I would however pay half for a 15 year old game without updates. That's been my stance since the announcement. I think half is generous for a game that will not need massive patches in the future and little to no infrastructure changes that many other multiplayer games handle for free once they're complete.
If I liked the cutting edge content "BFA" with new updates, new raids, new items being released I'd be more than hapy to pay 15.00. I put that kind of value in the current game, not time-bubble pieces.
I agree with you OP. I made a similar thread earlier that's fallen off the front page and I don't have the will to necro it.
Anyway, I got so many people in the thread telling me "You don't have to play the live game." To which I say, go away. I don't want to pay for Live WoW to get Classic for free or in the technical sense I suppose, pay for Classic and get Live for free. Just because something is free doesn't mean it's wanted. Not everyone takes free things just because they're free.
That being said I am not saying to make people on Live pay for a separate Classic sub, just that I would prefer the option for a Classic only sub.
Anyway, I got so many people in the thread telling me "You don't have to play the live game." To which I say, go away. I don't want to pay for Live WoW to get Classic for free or in the technical sense I suppose, pay for Classic and get Live for free. Just because something is free doesn't mean it's wanted. Not everyone takes free things just because they're free.
That being said I am not saying to make people on Live pay for a separate Classic sub, just that I would prefer the option for a Classic only sub.
11/03/2018 11:29 PMPosted by Gattzthey haven't posted sub numbers to refute the fake posted sub numbers recently. Why is that? Hmmmmmm.
They dont need to post the numbers, all they need to do is what they did and say they were not accurate. Youre telling me you would have believed them if they said 6 million?
11/03/2018 11:29 PMPosted by GattzStubs you have read my other posts and you keep asking the same questions for some odd reason. No I wouldn't pay 15 for a separate sub. I would however pay half for a 15 year old game without updates
I can't remember all of that man, i am sorry , but ok, thank you for answering. for what its worth I think that should be an option too, but I do think the combo part will stay even if they did that.
11/03/2018 11:29 PMPosted by GattzIf I liked the cutting edge content "BFA" with new updates, new raids, new items being released I'd be more than hapy to pay 15.00. I put that kind of value in the current game, not time-bubble pieces.
(wanted to include you too)11/04/2018 12:49 AMPosted by Velossenahat being said I am not saying to make people on Live pay for a separate Classic sub, just that I would prefer the option for a Classic only sub.
Rock on, I can respect that, all of this just illustrates how difficult this whole deal is, there is by far not a unified voice past the "We want Classic servers", soooo many sub groups make up all of that and they all have valid reasons(to them) for wanting what they want, to me 15$ combo or maybe 20 combo would be the highest I would go, and I fully support there being a smaller classic only sub.
It's free for me. I like free. I complain to Blizzard about all kinds of things but not giving me free things that I want.
Your 15 bucks may go to anything though. the production to WoW retail, Classic, D3, Sc2, etc. Even to pay for the support you may get. Also paying for the servers that house all the games you are playing on. When you pay for 15 bucks, try to not think about where you money exactly goes and know that you are paying to gain access to the content you want to play.
11/03/2018 09:11 PMPosted by DonkepuncherI would love to play classic. I'm willing to pay a sub to do that but at the same time I don't want any of that money going toward retail wow. I don't even want to have access to it... but mostly I don't want to support retail wow development in any way. I definitely won't be paying the same sub price for a game I played over a decade ago. 15 is a no-go.
Classic isn't for you. Classic is for BfA players, which is why it is free for a live sub. It serves two functions.
One is it gives people something to do during content drought. The reason it is free with BfA is because it will actually boost BfA daily user activity. People will stay subbed to play classic, but they'll still log in for whatever daily garrison free gold mechanic Blizz puts in. It's not so much that Blizz wants to combine your sub numbers with BfA. They want to boost the statistics for people actually logging into BfA every day. Instead of unsubbing to save money, people who stay subbed will still log into BfA for dailies. This makes BfA look good. This is why they aren't doing a cash grab like micro-transactions or 4/3 sub tokens. They are facing an existential crisis.
Two, they recognize there is something special about vanilla that causes fierce loyalty. But it's not actually for you. Classic could be a cash grab that makes money with a skeleton crew, but it isn't. It's a project by the WoW team, for the WoW team. They want to expose BfA subbers to classic and hopefully learn from vanilla. WoW classic being a low maintenance cash cow is great for Activision-Blizzard. It's not good for the WoW dev team who only keep their jobs because they produce new content. They aren't interested in making a product that competes with their own work either. They want to learn from it, the good, the bad, and figure out how to implement it in the future. That's why so many of the expansions after TBC talk about how they're going back to basics.
That's how I see it. Returnees' $15/mo is just icing on the cake. This is a project meant to prop up BfA now, then try to learn from vanilla, but through the lens of their current playerbase, for the future. It's not really meant to be a static world to bring back players to the place they think of as home. And maybe once they learn, they're hoping you'll buy their next expansion.
11/04/2018 01:03 AMPosted by XándriaYour 15 bucks may go to anything though. the production to WoW retail, Classic, D3, Sc2, etc. Even to pay for the support you may get. Also paying for the servers that house all the games you are playing on. When you pay for 15 bucks, try to not think about where you money exactly goes and know that you are paying to gain access to the content you want to play.
That revenue pool gets split back up based on which teams demonstrate promising figures or projects with great potential.
11/04/2018 01:33 AMPosted by KoushiClassic isn't for you. Classic is for BfA players, which is why it is free for a live sub. It serves two functions.
Gotta ask, honestly if you got your ideal sub model how many did you see coming back to play and now how many with the actual one they are using?
11/04/2018 01:41 AMPosted by Studmuffyn11/04/2018 01:33 AMPosted by KoushiClassic isn't for you. Classic is for BfA players, which is why it is free for a live sub. It serves two functions.
Gotta ask, honestly if you got your ideal sub model how many did you see coming back to play and now how many with the actual one they are using?
I don't really have an ideal sub model. It just so happens this one was near the bottom of my list because of demographic reasons. As you know already, my feeling is server populations are going to be dominated by BfA mains, and insufferable snobby vanilla cultists.
Prior to the announcement I thought classic was going to be a cash grab. $15/mo subs for returnees, 4/3 $20/mo cash grab just like $20 tokens for current subbers. I was thinking they weren't going for much of an increase in subs, but rather an increase in revenue streams, just like $20 tokens and micros, milking those people with extra disposable income. I was okay with that.
If I had to pick, my ideal sub model would be a one-time purchase with free access for live subbers (insert accusations of wanting classic for F R E E). It's 2018, servers are cheap, there's no further development needed for Classic. I actually do want Classic to be widely available to a wide audience of people, and I want the server communities to be large and diverse (and large and diverse enough for BfA mains to have little effect when they come and go). I want the casual returnees who hesitate to pay a sub when they don't know when they can find time to play, or have other things to spend money on. I want it to always be there so they can come back to it and log on whenever the urge hits them. I want new players to experience it. I even want those younger F2P players who can't afford better to experience it. I want BfA players to see what it was all about (without being the dominant plurality of the community). I want classic crusaders to have a place to call home (I guess... I actually prefer casuals over vanilla cultists).
So for my "ideal" sub model, a lot more. Of course that doesn't make money like subs does. What I want is at odds with revenue generation. Someone who subs for 3 years is worth 10 box buyers. But yeah, you already know if I say that, people are just gonna say I don't want to pay $15/mo and want it F R E E because of pservers or something.
I get $15 combo subs only now. I don't like it because it conflicts with what I want out of classic. They want to use classic as a launching pad to move forward. They don't want classic to be successful as its own game.
11/04/2018 02:04 AMPosted by KoushiI get $15 combo subs only now. I don't like it because it conflicts with what I want out of classic. They want to use classic as a launching pad to move forward. They don't want classic to be successful as its own game.
Olive branch...I get what you are saying, don't agree at all,, but thats ok, well some i actually do but really am tired of the back and forth, i was honestly asking like how many millions did you expect? or even millions at all? Personally like I have referenced the feeling I got was that it was more important to be able to play on legit servers than anything else, but like i stated somewhere , in this whole movement the only unifying sentiment was"We want Classic servers!" and after than you have tons of smaller groups with some crossover here and there, but usually more than a few differences.
No matter how they decide to charge you... combined sub, one time fee, different sub... the money is going to Blizzard and they will do as they please with it.
The way to stick a middle finger up to retail is to not buy the expansions.
For all you know, in a few years they might make an amazing expansion later down the road and you could be glad you won't have to pay two subs anyway.
The way to stick a middle finger up to retail is to not buy the expansions.
For all you know, in a few years they might make an amazing expansion later down the road and you could be glad you won't have to pay two subs anyway.
11/03/2018 09:11 PMPosted by DonkepuncherI don't want any of that money going toward retail wow.
That is not an option you ever had available. Not an option you could have ever realistically thought you had available either.
11/03/2018 09:11 PMPosted by DonkepuncherI don't even want to have access to it... but mostly I don't want to support retail wow development in any way.
1. When you give Blizz your money they decide where it goes. You're "supporting retail" no matter what.
2. Nobody is gonna hold a gun to your head and force you to install BFA. Chill.
11/04/2018 02:04 AMPosted by KoushiI get $15 combo subs only now. I don't like it because it conflicts with what I want out of classic. They want to use classic as a launching pad to move forward. They don't want classic to be successful as its own game.
Olive branch...I get what you are saying, don't agree at all, well some i actually do but really am tired of back and forth, but thats ok, i was honestly asking like how many millions did you expect? or even millions at all?
As a cash grab? In the range of 100k to 1,000,000 with a mix of returnees and combosubs. Definitely not 10,000,000, but enough to produce a healthy revenue stream to justify the project. I was expecting it to have development costs closer to pserver basement dwellers though.
I couldn't even begin to place a figure on a box purchase number, but with free BfA access, somewhere in the millions. But I never seriously expected a one-time purchase from Activision. I only entertained the thought to wonder if it would be commercially viable (I think it would) and if it made the highest revenue (it wouldn't).