Classic + is the only way, doing TBC and onward would be horrible!

[Holymirax-ashkandi]

@Kreivos-bloodsail-buccaneers

Eh, I’ll be honest, I’m playing Classic right now because I’m still kind of hoping for a progression server type deal. Eventually I’ll want to hit TBC with this character, and later Wrath, etc.

If they ever forced my character into progressing id quit. Bc and wrath as separate servers i can play infinitely? Sure. Separate forced progression? Sure.

[Hotgarbage-heartseeker]

oh wow i really did… add that in there. that expansion was baddd LOL

[Shocktastic-mankrik]

LOL and it was people like YOU who were crying for changes to the game that MADE retail that way to begin with. LFG, CRZ, LFR, etc. were all features designed to try to keep dead servers from being merged or deleted because so many people had either quit the game or rerolled/transferred to a higher pop realm.

All of the QoL things in the game you claim to hate were Blizzard catering to people like you who QQ’d and whined for those changes to be added. It is you who fail to realize that people like you are the ones who killed the game and made it into the state that retail is in right now…Get THAT through YOUR head

[Karckus-turalyon]

And, yet, TBC and WotLK were the two most popular expansions.

Stop with this Classic+ crap. Stop trying to reinvent the wheel. Stop pretending that Classic is the 2nd coming of WoW. It’s not here to replace retail. It’s just an alternative.

If anything needs to “change”, it’s retail. Go on your crusade to fix that.

[Festukarg-wyrmrest-accord]

retail is dead and it wont get undead unless they remove crz and warmode and LFG. tbc and wotlk were more popular because wow was new when it came out and word of mouth spread. make a better argument please.

[Karckus-turalyon]

Lol, you can’t make a terrible argument then demand that I give you a good one. You make a better argument that isn’t rooted in hyperbole and personal bias first, and then I will consider listening to you.

Until then, buzz off.

[Pelinal-goldrinn]

i never saw so much fallacies in one single post.
Even with TBC and Wrath, flying still made the world Feel BIG.

later adjustments and the subsequent increase on mount flying speed made it look smaller.

TBC Mount Flying Speed, the most BASIC was 60%, ARTISAN was expensive, it was a commodity and reward for hard work in saving money, and the max flying speed.

[Shocktastic-mankrik]

LOL like your arguments are any better??? Sorry you don’t appreciate Classic for what it is and can’t seem to enjoy the game like the rest of us without needing to add your own personal changes to it.

Given the fact that your avatar is still only level 10, I’m just going to quit responding to your moronic posts and dismiss you as a retail troll accordingly. Get to level 30+ and tell me what you think about the game and maybe then we can have a real discussion

[Tenshirou-feathermoon (Tenshirou)]

@Stango-benediction

I agree tbc is better game but i think a couple things like flying and arena stray far from the formula that will make it more immersive. We now have the chance to fix the wrongs and make them right.

This logic always makes me roll my eyes. If you are willing to do that to TBC, then the devs can do the same to Classic.

Lets add AoE loot.
More flight points and graveyards.
Change class balance so it works better.
Put in shared loot so you can get through quests in busy areas quicker.

None of these, except may class balance, change the base game and are only QoL. By the same logic of changing TBC, this is fair game, only it changes the game less.

[Grumbledor-sulfuras]

@Kickrøckz-proudmoore

You have numbers! WoW…how’s that working out for you?

Show me…let’s see your “numbers”.

What do you have but opinion?

@Kickrøckz-proudmoore

Really? So you think correlation equals causation? Just stop…wrong person to mess with.

Is that a threat?

@Kickrøckz-proudmoore

Oh, you’re such a white knight…tell me more!

Ok, so you had absolutely nothing to say of value there. Anyone who played Vanilla knows real-world PvP ended with BG’s and then Arenas. South shore v Tarren mill stopped happening when BG’s came into being. Ya, you might have little scuffles but those have been happening for years and never really stopped.

Your post there is the definition of trolling, you complained and gave nothing of value to add but threats and name-calling it seems. If you want to blame something for ending Wpvp as I said it’s really 3 things, BG’s, Arena’s, and Removal of the HK system.

[Tenshirou-feathermoon (Tenshirou)]

@Grumbledor-sulfuras

Ok, so you had absolutely nothing to say of value there

A solution to her problem.

Classic + is the only way, doing TBC and onward would be horrible!

Kickrøckz is replying in a way that is pure troll. Either ignore any comments from this player or report for trolling. Here is why: Making comments that attack a person with no real answer to the other party. Posting links that do nothing, but intent to make a person rage. When facts are given that show something other than what the person claims, says they are wrong and then attacks the person. It is not someone who wants a conversation, but someone who just wants to attack people for per…

[Shocktastic-mankrik]

@Grumbledor-sulfuras

Anyone who played Vanilla knows real-world PvP ended with BG’s and then Arenas. South shore v Tarren mill stopped happening when BG’s came into being. Ya, you might have little scuffles but those have been happening for years and never really stopped.

This right here…it had nothing to do with flying and anyone who says or thinks otherwise is just delusional. Add in the dishonorable kills lowering your honor, and the wpvp particpation happened even LESS.

@Merridae-aerie-peak

You seriously need to stop shoveling this Hoss Hockey friend. World PvP died in Vanilla on the release of patch 1.5.0. I have numbers to prove it. Prior to patch 1.5.0 World PvP participation was nearly 90% on pvp and NON pvp realms. After patch 1.5.0 (like literally that week) World PvP went from 90 percent participation to below 20% participation. Battlegrounds killed World PvP. You need to take that Flying killed WPvP crapola back where you bought it and get a refund cause someone sold you a bill of goods.

We can easily prove this statement by closely looking at the wpvp participation numbers on Classic leading UP to phase 3 (Which are the BG’s and honor/ranking system) and AFTER. If these numbers fall off in the exact same way, then what Meri said earlier will be absolutely TRUE

[Grumbledor-sulfuras]

@Wirt-stalagg

You’re just proving more and more that Vanilla was not the most popular version of the game lol, 12 mil is 12 mil, the game always has a bit of a spike on expansion launch.

Vanilla topped out at 8 million, TBC had 11 leading into WotLK, WotLK had 12, Cata had 12 when it released and dropped to close to 9 million then jumped to 10 for MoP release. As we can see flying did not cause any sub loss, bad game and class design did.

WotLK started at 11.5 and ended with 12, Soon as Cata launched it dropped to 11.4 by the end of the first quarter.

[Stango-benediction]

I never wanted no changes. I played vanilla. I would’ve loved alot of changes to it. Granted vanilla is way better than BFA. In 2 years something will have to change or i will unsub after i get through aq40 or maybe into naxx. I want good group pvp which was abandoned for arena. I hope for good bg rating system or a new wpvp system. Also rewards are intertwined to raiding not separated like tbc did.
I dont think classic is good enough to just keep playing. It wiil be tbc or classic plus. I vote for classic plus really just that simple. I

[Stango-benediction]

Flying not that big of a deal. Bgs killed wpvp already. If they make wpvp a thing then flying is a issue. The loot tier system and lfg killed the community and goals of the game.

Wow is a pve game with a pvp mini game. When they tried to make pvp its own game seperate from the core pve is when i lost alot of interest. I wanted to raid to do better in pvp. Now pvp is a crappy version of other games. Go play smite instead of a fun thing you can do with your better pve gear/raiding exp.

[Grumbledor-sulfuras]

@Stango-benediction

The loot tier system and lfg killed the community and goals of the game.

I would say by leaps and bounds Addons like Carbonite, Questie, Gear Score, Simcraft, ETC, and information gathering sites like “The Armory”, Warcraft Logs, and IO did the vast majority of damage to the community. Min Maxing is what killed the Community and this was possible by allowing FAR to much information about players and the game to be available to players.

Min Maxing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flying/LFR/LFD when it comes to what killed the community IMO.

[Stango-benediction]

I dont think so. Minmax was always a thing. When the loot tier and finding group system became automated just made minmax a higher point then a friend you can count on or dedication to the guild.

I think the gearing system that let ilvl be a thing might be what caused the issues you talk about.

I dont think a ilvl can work in classic since you need so much of a stat before ot caps. So item power is not as important as having the proper stats. Also threat agro changed the gearing and skill caps for players.

[Pelinal-goldrinn]

the minmaxing problem in classic is mostly because of the badly planned gear prior to BWL and AQ, and mostly the forced 1 shot talent builds caused by the badly 1.1 talent trees.

Now people, from both retail and even pservers are discovering new stuff with classic than people who played back then and advocated the #nochanges bullcrap.

[Stango-benediction]

Its not a problem. People will always look to optimize. Some like optimization more then friends is the problem. If the gear is hard to get and alot builds and parallel gear with custom caps makes it harder to minmax and grade someone gear score or dps.

[Gaara-arugal]

@Shocktastic-mankrik

This right here…it had nothing to do with flying and anyone who says or thinks otherwise is just delusional. Add in the dishonorable kills lowering your honor, and the wpvp particpation happened even LESS.

And I feel like anyone who doesn’t think that it was flying that killed world PVP is delusional. That includes you. So why should I listen to a delusional person? Seen all your replies and it really feels like you are reaching for any kind of argument.